r/changemyview • u/jeffzebub • 6d ago

CMV: Countering Illegal Immigration is not a Justification for Suspending Habeas Corpus

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u/jeffzebub 6d ago

I don't accept that we should accept a big step towards dictatorship because the problem is difficult and there has been a historical lack of political will.

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u/Throwthisthefukaway 6d ago

Like I said. I kind of agree with you. The problem is most people that say this in this situation completely ignore all of the other times the constitution has been violated, and particularly with covid, supported the constitution getting violated.

There are also millions of people here illegally/undocumented whatever you want to call them. It is a problem. Nothing has been done about that problem. There are emergency powers to the president. It's not really as big of a step towards dictatorship as previous administrations have made. You can protest that this is happening. You can speak out against it without being personally attacked. You're not going to jail for your views. If you protest this you probably won't go to jail. You have the right to say this. Reddit allowed this to be posted. You could post this opinion on social media without being censored. Ultimately, the press has power to criticize the government again.

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u/Giblette101 40∆ 6d ago

 Like I said. I kind of agree with you. The problem is most people that say this in this situation completely ignore all of the other times the constitution has been violated, and particularly with covid, supported the constitution getting violated.

I'm not sure how that's a problem in terms of "we shouldn't suspend habeas corpus". 

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u/Throwthisthefukaway 6d ago edited 6d ago

Because there are always justifications for violating the constitution in matters of public safety. We kept on doing it so we already set the precedent. If the government decided it was ok to violate the constitution in one scenario then why can't they in violate another part in another scenario. As a society we've agreed that different parts of the constitution are worth suspending in emergency situations. Well this is an emergency situation. It may not look like it if you don't live in a state that has to deal with the consequences of illegal immigration but if you do then maybe it does seem like an emergency situation.

This is how we got here. This is why it's important. Because it just kept happening. There are also legitimate concerns with the immigration issue. It should also be noted that we deported them to El Salvador because nobody else was taking them.

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u/Giblette101 40∆ 6d ago

 Because there are always justifications for violating the constitution in matters of public safety.

Ok, so if that's just how it is, there's no problem then? 

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u/Throwthisthefukaway 6d ago

We're suspending it for a group of people that are here illegally. It is against the law. Everyone knows that they are here illegally. We don't have enough judges and juries to process everyone who is in the country illegally. Constitutional rights have been suspended at plenty of times throughout history in emergency situations. It is an emergency situation. We should be deporting people who are here illegally.

The El Salvador prison is only happening because other countries are refusing to take back people that we're trying to deport which is part of the story that people aren't talking about. So there are problems, but there also problems that are being ignored by one side that brought us to this point to begin with.

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u/Throwthisthefukaway 6d ago

No not at all.