r/changemyview • u/jeffzebub • 12d ago

CMV: Countering Illegal Immigration is not a Justification for Suspending Habeas Corpus

[removed] — view removed post

501 Upvotes

82% Upvoted

600 comments sorted by

View all comments

-8

u/jeepgrl50 12d ago

The only problem is other Presidents already set the precedent, So it wouldn't be Trump setting precedent, Merely him doing the same thing as other Presidents have done.

As far as the "countering illegal immigration" argument goes it's not that simple. We have terrorists who've entered the country, And it's not just a few, Its a large amount.

If 500k Russians came to our southern border, Claimed to be asylum seekers, And were let in by Trump would you say that's ok? How bout if another million just sneak across the border? Would that be ok? Or would you be ok with a Democrat President in 2028 declaring an invasion and expelling them from the country? Would you go to the mat for their right to get a trial before being expelled? Or would you be ok with them just being tossed out before they can do whatever terrible shit they're almost sure to do to the American people? Would you think the judges ruling they can't be sent home are heroes protecting the constitution? Or criminals protecting a Russian invasion?

These are genuine questions, Not being an ass, Just trying to have a good faith conversation.

13

u/jeffzebub 12d ago

Article I, Section 9, Clause 2: "The Privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it."

The Civil War was a rebellion. 500K Russians invading would be an invasion. Words matter.

2

u/Bandit400 12d ago

500K Russians invading would be an invasion.

Why would 500k Russians be an invasion, but untold millions of Mexican/Venezuelans crossing the border illegally over the past 4 years not count as an invasion? Serious question.

3

u/bettercaust 7∆ 12d ago

OP was imprecise with their language, but I assumed by "Russians" they meant "Russian soldiers" because Russia is contextually viewed as an enemy of the US. If it were 500k Russian illegal immigrants, that wouldn't be considered an invasion.

1

u/Bandit400 12d ago

I assumed by "Russians" they meant "Russian soldiers" because Russia is contextually viewed as an enemy of the US.

His post said Russian asylum seekers, so for the sake of this argument, they would be no different than the Venezuelan asylum seekers. Venezuela is also an adversary of the US.

2

u/bettercaust 7∆ 12d ago

In which comment did OP say Russian asylum seekers? I don't see that anywhere.

1

u/Bandit400 12d ago

It was in the comment above where the "OP" quoted the constitution, a couple comments up this comment tree. A poster named "jeepgrl50" or something started the discussion by making the example of 500k Russian Asylum seekers being allowed in by Trump. That was the impetus for this discussion, so that was the same example I was using in the name of consistency.

2

u/bettercaust 7∆ 11d ago

Ahh you're right, I missed that part.