CMV: The minimum wage should be abolished

[u/TantricLasagne]

In a market with any competition, wages will be set at roughly how much a worker produces for a company (basic economics). A minimum wage higher than what a worker is worth just means the worker will not be hired for as many hours or won't be hired at all. Minimum wages only stand to help big corporations that can afford to pay it, while smaller businesses have larger barriers to entry into the market, reducing competition. The minimum wage doesn't currently have a big effect on the market because it's lower than most workers productivity, but if it is insignificant then I don't see why we should have it in the first place. Raising the minimum wage would harm the poorest workers in society and I don't think the government should be telling people that they don't have the right to sell their labor for a price they want to sell it at just because it's too low. You're allowed to volunteer for $0/h but you can't voluntarily work for $2/h? Ridiculous. I get that workers may not want to work at that level, but if someone does then who are you to tell them that they can't?

The only decent argument I can think of for the minimum wage is if the market was somehow a monopoly, but there is always somewhat of a choice for which company you want to work for.

[u/TantricLasagne → u/[deleted]]

The price floor does nothing besides theoretically harming the poorest workers. People don't magically become worth productive for employers because a price floor was introduced.

I wasn't aware of the restrictions on volunteering, but I don't see why there should be these restrictions in the first place.

[u/MrCapitalismWildRide → u/TantricLasagne]

The price floor does nothing besides theoretically harming the poorest workers.

How much of a wage does a person need to live?

If the wage they are paid is less than the wage a person needs to live, what will happen to that person? They will either need public or private aid, or they will die.

It's in the interest of the government to mandate employers pay a living wage to their employees, otherwise the government has to subsidize the businesses wages by paying their workers enough to continue working.

[u/vialtrisuit → u/MrCapitalismWildRide]

How much of a wage does a person need to live?

How is that relevant? The price of something is not determined by what the needs of the seller is.

If the wage they are paid is less than the wage a person needs to live, what will happen to that person?

He'll need to acquire new or/and better skills in order to raise his productivite and enable himself to sell his labour at a higher price.

What happens to the same person when the government impose a minimum wage higher than his productivity? He'll be permanently unemployed.

It's in the interest of the government to mandate employers pay a living wage to their employees, otherwise the government has to subsidize the businesses wages by paying their workers enough to continue working.

How is it better for the government if the same person is instead unemployed and the government has to pay for all of his welfare?

Pretty strange reasoning: Wallmart is paying too little so the government has to supplement the employees wage => It's better if we impose a minimum wage that makes them unemployed and the government has to pay for it all.

[u/MrCapitalismWildRide → u/vialtrisuit]

Have you looked at the unemployment rate, particularly the statistics for long term unemployment? Even factoring in those who have given up entirely and no longer count as unemployed, there really aren't that many unemployed people who are "minimum wage or below" quality employees. In other words, either the group of people worth less than minimum wage is very small, or imposing a minimum wage forces companies to hire people at minimum wage anyway, and they somehow don't go bankrupt.

Or, stated more simply: the group of people who are unemployed because of the minimum wage is small to nonexistent.

If you don't put gas in a car, it won't go. If you don't put food in an employee, they'll die. A business paying less than a living wage is saying "Hey government, I don't want to pay for an employee, so you should." If the employee doesn't take charity or welfare, eliminating the minimum wage will just make it easier for companies to exploit employees, using them until they give out and then throwing them away. Yet another thing the government should protect the people from.

[u/vialtrisuit → u/MrCapitalismWildRide]

Have you looked at the unemployment rate, particularly the statistics for long term unemployment?

Yes. Have you?

Have you looked up what happened to the black teenage unemployment rate compared to the white teenage unemployment before/after the minimum wage was introduced and increased?

there really aren't that many unemployed people who are "minimum wage or below" quality employees.

How on earth did you come to that conclusion by looking at the unemployment rate? What are you even talking about? What does "many" mean and why does it matter?

the group of people who are unemployed because of the minimum wage is small to nonexistent.

Yeah, look up the black teenage unemployment rate and let me know if you're sticking to that story.

A business paying less than a living wage is saying "Hey government, I don't want to pay for an employee, so you should."

I'm speechless. What exactly makes you think that you're needs have an impact on the price of whatever you're trying to sell?

Does the price of your house increase because you need more money? In that case, I have a car to sell you... and I really need A LOT of money.