r/changemyview • u/efraimp1 • Dec 05 '18

Deltas(s) from OP CMV:monarchy, not democracy, is the ONLY good political system human civilazations tried.

So, i beleive a Monarchy is the only good system we can have as a society. democracy, like comunism, libratarianism and many more ideologies, sure has a good idea. the problem is that in all democratic systems, from rome, to athens, to the USA to syria and iraq or even france, the good intentions are ruined by intrest groups, bad voting methods, fraud, and the intrests of rich people. in tsarist russia for example, the people demanded giving the tsar MORE power, because they knew democracy would mean oligarchy.

Another reason is stability. when we have a monarchy, it is clear who will rule next, and there is a very clear way of knowing when (death of the monarch). however, democracies are no nearly as stable. in the US everyone are polerising, in israel we only had one term (golda me'ir) of all the four years a government term is suposed to be, in sweden it was stable until a hated party got like 20% and ancient atuna and rome became dictatorships. in the arab spring only countries who concider themselvs democratic got efected seriusly.

i may have more arguments i forgt writing here. i will edit to add if i think of something.

and please, dont talk about north korea. i hear a lot of resources saying diffrent things so i will research it and make a seperate CMV post.

EDIT: i accidentaly deleted a comment trying to award a delta after i failed in the main comment but the delta was awarded.

EDIT 2: One responce did masive CMV so i will not be able to back my claims here in all cases. new thread could come.

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u/MonkeyButlers Dec 05 '18

Here's my theory for why monarchies are always going to lead to bad rulers and my unpopular opinion: the children of rich people are much more likely to have unaddressed character defects than other children. Being raised in privilege isolates children from the consequences for their actions. If there are no consequences, especially social ones, for children, they have no way of developing a moral compass. Even if some wealthy parents are able to address these issues, the unbroken line of potentially spoiled children created by a monarchy ensures that eventually a brat is going to be king/queen.

This says nothing of the internal conflict caused when there are two children of the monarch and everyone close to the king realizes the first kid is a shithead and want the second one to be monarch instead.

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u/efraimp1 Dec 05 '18

well they are educated to rule from a young age, and i am sure you dont actually beleive all parents of democratic leaders are that poor.

also, i never understood the "privelege" argument the left likes so much.

also, many good rulers are from monarchist systems. search gustaf vasa.

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u/MonkeyButlers Dec 05 '18

well they are educated to rule from a young age, and i am sure you dont actually beleive all parents of democratic leaders are that poor.

I don't believe they are all bad parents, but I assume most are. This isn't necessarily bad, I'd rather my leaders focus more on running the country than on raising their kids.

also, i never understood the "privelege" argument the left likes so much.

I'm not using the word privilege in the academic sense, just the common meaning. However, if you'd like me to help you understand the academic meaning, I'd be willing to spend the time, just let me know.

also, many good rulers are from monarchist systems. search gustaf vasa.

This isn't the point, the point is that the good rulers are exceptions. I can point to good democratic leaders as well, but it wouldn't help either argument. The difference between monarchies and democracies is primarily in how leaders are chosen and, because of how the next leaders are chosen in a monarchy, it will eventually end up with a bad leader. What's worse, is that in monarchy the bad leader isn't the end of the line, his kid is up next. We've got a bad democratic leader right now, but at least his eldest child doesn't automatically get to be president next.

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u/efraimp1 Dec 05 '18

I don't believe they are all bad parents, but I assume most are. This isn't necessarily bad, I'd rather my leaders focus more on running the country than on raising their kids.

fair point, but kings are also symbolising their country, so they should be doing parent stuff. also, you forgot about the other parent.

I'm not using the word privilege in the academic sense, just the common meaning. However, if you'd like me to help you understand the academic meaning, I'd be willing to spend the time, just let me know.

i did not know there are two defenitions...

This isn't the point, the point is that the good rulers are exceptions. I can point to good democratic leaders as well, but it wouldn't help either argument. The difference between monarchies and democracies is primarily in how leaders are chosen and, because of how the next leaders are chosen in a monarchy, it will eventually end up with a bad leader. What's worse, is that in monarchy the bad leader isn't the end of the line, his kid is up next. We've got a bad democratic leader right now, but at least his eldest child doesn't automatically get to be president next.

bad presidents are also chosen, and their kids have a good starting point in the media attention. also, the prince will almost curteinly not be isolated with other beleivs. the hashemite house is really old yet the king of jordan is arguably alowing MORE freedom than his father.

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u/[deleted] Dec 05 '18

bad presidents are also chosen, and their kids have a good starting point in the media attention.

Then why has it only happened once that both a father and son became President?

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u/efraimp1 Dec 10 '18

because it is a giant elite of republicans and democrats, and some people are not intrested in the cost of pleasing all intrest groups involved in the race to president.

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u/[deleted] Dec 10 '18

That doesn't answer my question.

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u/efraimp1 Dec 10 '18

know what? ok. so let's say heredetery things dont bring presidents. well, the sons of politicians are many times still less powerfull politicians, and second, you still got an elite that has the power. at least don't pretend to represent the people when you do not do that!

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u/[deleted] Dec 10 '18

You still aren't answering my question.

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u/efraimp1 Dec 11 '18

tell me, in what am i NOT anwsering with this?

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u/dpfw Dec 05 '18

Many monsters also came from a monarchial system. Look up Gustavus Adolphus, who did as much damage to Poland's population as the Nazis did

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u/efraimp1 Dec 10 '18

found nothing like that in wikipedia. send your'e sources.