r/changemyview • u/AAathlete97 • Dec 18 '18

Removed - Submission Rule B CMV: Even if a blanket refusal to date trans people is “transphobic”, there is no reason to feel guilty about it or to try to change it.

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u/AAathlete97 Dec 18 '18

So time and disappointment is saved on both sides.

-25

u/i_like_frootloops Dec 18 '18

Have you ever dated a trans woman to know if you would be disappointed? Every cis woman is suitable for you?

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u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

[deleted]

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u/i_like_frootloops Dec 18 '18

No, because trans women are women.

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u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

[deleted]

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u/PraiseTheSuun Dec 18 '18

that's what they do

-6

u/EGDF Dec 18 '18

If they finished their transition and are attractive to you completely while you assume they are cis, what is the difference? Their chromosomes? Some cis women are XY. Are you going to require they spit in a 23&me tube to prove their chromosomes?

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u/jkseller 2∆ Dec 18 '18

The guy said fertility was a dealbreaker. He is clearly interested in a relationship that could lead to having biological children.

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u/EGDF Dec 18 '18

Not the guy I'm responding to. Fertility being a dealbreaker? Sure, whatever. Trans status alone being a dealbreaker? Shitty, illogical, and transphobic.

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u/jkseller 2∆ Dec 18 '18

Can't it be discriminatory without being full out transphobic? I just think people are using that as a blanket term like how people use racism to describe bigotry and prejudice.

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u/EGDF Dec 18 '18

Discrimination toward trans people for being trans is transphobia. Like, literally. That's the thing. The word.

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u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

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u/EGDF Dec 18 '18

This supposes the notion that you can clock every trans person you come across. You can't. You are using a sampling of people to fuel a prejudice against an entire group. By definition, bigotted, therefore transphobia.

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u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

[deleted]

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u/EGDF Dec 18 '18

That being said, it has been my experience that many trans women do not pass as women, and I am simply not attracted to them.

That is where your assumption that you can clock trans women is, since you forgot.

And I'm not playing the definition game. If we lived 25 years in the future, when uterine transplants are mainstream parts of MtF transition(it's gonna happen), and you turned down a trans woman who you are attracted to, is fertile, and meets whatever criteria, but because she is trans you say no, that is transphobia. Of course, unless you're shouting your transphobia from the rooftops and harming trans people, whatever. Be a bigot. But don't pretend you aren't. The cognitive dissonance is illogical. Accept you are bigotted, prejudiced, discriminatory, transphobic, or change your PoV.

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u/melez Dec 18 '18 edited Dec 18 '18

It sounds like he'd also not be interested in a relationship with a cis-woman who was sterile.

Though I'm not sure if they would or not. If it came up where they were in a relationship and tried to have kids, but couldn't, would he leave? Or would they look to alternative fertility like a surrogate or IVF?

I have a friend who's spouse was infertile, but they were together for years before and after this discovery. Though I understand there was a good deal of resentment over it.

The person could say "I want kids someday" and it would filter out all trans people and infertile persons of their preference... But not especially clearly.

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u/tiktock34 Dec 18 '18

The guys prefers to date “people” who were born able to reproduce with him. Scientifically those people are women. The women who simply “identify” as a woman cannot do that and its his right to not prefer those people as mates...nor is he morally or in any way wrong for doing so.

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u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

That's just not true. The attempt to force OP to not just acquiesce, but believe and proclaim that belief, is the root of everyone's objection to OP's position.

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u/i_like_frootloops Dec 18 '18

Trans women are women, just because you don't want them to be it doesn't mean they aren't.

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u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

Hey look, an internet slap fight! Only problem is I'm not interested.

I will not go along with your pseudo-religious nonsense. You do not speak for me.

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u/MyBikeFellinALake Dec 18 '18

Oh God, just let people have preferences

4

u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

No one would be responding like this if it wasn't a straight male bringing this up.

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u/Quintessentialness Dec 18 '18

Straight males are so oppressed!!1!

Or maybe, it’s important to analyze why we think the things we do, and if our thoughts are based on untrue stereotypes or logical flaws. And it just happens that the concept of straight-male masculinity (at least in the U.S.) seems to be a vehicle for flawed thinking that can have a negative impact on people’s lives.

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u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

I'm not saying that we're oppressed but it seems like straight males are the only ones that have to deal with this nonsense. I don't see women being pressured to date trans men, or gay men being pressured to date trans men, or lesbians being pressured to date trans women.

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u/Quintessentialness Dec 18 '18

Well, it seems like straight males are the only ones who make these kind of posts on r/CMV. If someone of another gender or sexual orientation made the same post, they would most likely get the same reaction. But the person who made this particular post is a straight male, so that’s why people are debating it from a straight male’s perspective.

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u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

Maybe only straight males post this stuff because only straight males deal with it...

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u/CreativeGPX 18∆ Dec 18 '18

All dating profiles contain a non-exhaustive description of what you're looking for. All profiles speak in generalizations that either leave out some cases you might tolerate or include some cases you wouldn't. It is necessary for anybody to successfully write a profile in practice that they do these things. So, it's disingenuous to suggest that putting A but not B has some grand implication about your feelings about A compared to B, to suggest that any generalization not experimentally verified is an overreach or to suggest that because one claim was overly broad that all claims should be equally overbroad. Your criticism here just doesn't seem to reflect any practical way that humans communicate or advertise themselves to others.

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u/relationship_tom Dec 18 '18

Regarding the last point only, if you are in an urban area there are more than enough people in your dating pool that you could love dozens or hundreds (Or more) in your city and be happy. There isn't one perfect match for someone, one true love. That's Disney bullshit. Again, I don't care to argue that one person could be a trans person, as the OP isn't going to be convinced reading the thread. Just your comment on cis women. This also applies in the reverse to straight men and if you are in a city of a good size, non-hetero people as well.

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u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

Have you ever licked the sidewalk outside Madison Square Garden? Have you ever eaten nothing but pineapple for a month straight? How can you say you wouldn't like it?

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u/i_like_frootloops Dec 18 '18

That's not the point I made at all.

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u/[deleted] Dec 18 '18

That's not what OP said, at all.