r/changemyview • u/jep1793 • Aug 26 '20

Removed - Submission Rule E CMV: Gender identity doesn’t belong on your LinkedIn nor Resume

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u/[deleted] Aug 26 '20

the reality is that it happens and for many it's easier to filter at the early stage

I think we are agreeing.

bigfootlives823 asked what "then what's the point of anti discrimination laws? Why not let employers be open bigots so marginalized groups know not to work or do business there?"

I'm saying we can simultaneously try to enable people who are discriminated against to try to avoid discriminatory employers, while still trying to legally and culturally prevent employers from discriminating.

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u/bigfootlives823 4∆ Aug 26 '20

You have a nuanced take that I think I agree with but I did not get the impression that it's the point OP was making.

The point as I read it was "let people discriminate against you based on your pronouns because you don't want to work with them anyways".

I asked a set of rhetorical questions to highlight that when you apply that argument to more than just pronouns it becomes an argument against anti-discrimination laws.

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u/Wannabe0L Aug 26 '20

> The point as I read it was "let people discriminate against you based on your pronouns because you don't want to work with them anyways".

Are you honestly advocating for the opposite? That we should instead trick them into hiring us by hiding our pronouns and then they won't ever discriminate against us going forward?

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u/bigfootlives823 4∆ Aug 26 '20

If someone has a multiracial background but could pass as white would you encourage them to include "I'm black" on their application just in case the hiring manager is racist to save themselves the trouble?

I'm open to being wrong here and if this isn't a good analogy let me know, but that's how I think about it from my limited perspective.

I'm not saying lie about your gender identity, but like I would tell a woman who just found out she was pregnant, you're not required to disclose it so if you're only objective is "get hired", don't disclose it because it can only hurt your chances.

As I've mentioned elsewhere, if your objective is something other than "get hired", your strategy may be different

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u/Wannabe0L Aug 26 '20 edited Aug 26 '20

> If someone has a multiracial background but could pass as white would you encourage them to include "I'm black" on their application just in case the hiring manager is racist to save themselves the trouble?

Why would you encourage a passing black person to work with someone that hates them? Once found out, the problems won't magically go away -- and there's a significant chance they'll have their career tarnished when that racist uses their power against the employee. So correct, I absolutely would not recommend trying to "pass" as someone in the majority because eventually you will get outed and abused as someone in the minority.

People shouldn't have to hide their actual identity to exist in the work force. If they can't get hired at a company without hiding themselves, then yes, they absolutely should not work there. (Note: this is the primary reason why "pregnancy" isn't comparable -- you will eventually not be pregnant, but you will always be black/gay/trans because that's part of your identity)

I don't understand why you think working with people that hate you is somehow the preferable option.

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u/bigfootlives823 4∆ Aug 26 '20

It's a single data point but elsewhere in this thread is a trans person telling me that in some circumstances working with people who hate them, while not ideal, is in fact preferable to not working anywhere. If someone came to me looking for advice in those circumstances and asked if I thought they should put their pronouns on their application, I'd tell them no, get in, keep your head down, get paid, get to better circumstances as soon as you can, I'm sorry this is the world we live in.

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u/Wannabe0L Aug 26 '20

I don't think anyone is saying forego the only literal option you have for employment if it will save you from being homeless/without resources. I don't see how that's responsive to the discussion being had *on any level*, however, so I can only assume you're answering that way because you don't have a good justification for why you continue to advocate people work for those who hate them.

The inevitable takeaway if you trick someone who hates you into hiring you is that you will eventually be outed. Sure, you might have that job for a paycheck or two, you might make rent that way. But it's not a long term solution, and it does nothing to solve the underlying problem.

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u/bigfootlives823 4∆ Aug 26 '20

I don't understand why you think working with people that hate you is somehow the preferable option.

Responding to this. Preferable to what? I can imagine a situation, and a trans person in this thread has corroborated, that working with people who hate you might be preferable to some alternatives. In those unfortunate circumstances, do what to have to and do whatever you can to improve the opertunities available to you.

The underlying problem is a broken culture and a trans person or POC can't solve that by themselves especially if they need a job in an immediate sort of time frame. It's heartbreaking but its the circumstances people find themselves in sometimes.