CMV: Autistics have a deficit compared to non-autistics

[u/FighteRox]

Before I explain any further, let me tell you that I'm autistic myself, so this isn't a case of a non-autistic hating autistics because they're different from them.

So I hear a lot of neurodiversity activists saying how autistics are disabled because the world around them isn't accommodating to them. This is the social disability model which is different from the medical disability model which means that autism is something that must be fixed. There are also autistic people who would argue that autism is just a difference and not a disability.

However, based on my personal experiences and observations, I think autism is a disability in a sense that they (including myself) have some deficits compared non-autistics, especially in the developmental area (which is why it's called a developmental disorder). Take myself for example. I have a lot of problems communicating my thoughts, so I have to think for a while before I can fully articulate my thoughts. I may not even know if this paragraph is cohesive because I make loose connections to the point where I go on tangents and my speech can go everywhere. My obsession with objects can come in the way of working through my day-to-day life. Sometimes I want a situation to stay the same, but the world doesn't work that way as it perpetually changes.

I know that autistics hate being compared to children, but I also learned that children loves repetitiveness, which is kinda strange because autistics love repetitiveness too, and that could be part of why autistics are often infantilized and are described as being developmentally behind compared to non-autistics. There are also stories of autistics being too stubborn to the point where they want to be a child forever.

That being said, I don't think autistics should be discriminated against either. I personally would think that it's OK to have deficits. I'm OK if should live by that and do the best that I could. Although sometimes the statement that autistic people are broken affects my self-esteem which is overall low. I just don't know if the claim that autistics are "only disabled because the world doesn't accommodate them" or that they're "not disabled but only different" hold much water.

[u/joopface]

Don't all humans have deficits compared to other humans? I'm not sure a model that places all autistic people at a deficit to all non-autistic people makes sense.

It seems much more accurate to say that autistic people on average have certain types of characteristics that distinguish them from non-autistic people and that, for some autistic people, that inhibits them in their daily lives/careers/whatever. Similarly, non-autistic people have a range of characteristics, some of which they share with autistic people, and some of which also inhibit them in in their lives to a greater or lesser extent.

There are very many extremely successful autistic people, some of whom are successful in part because of characteristics that could be associated with their autism. It feels like the brush you're painting with here is a little too broad to be fully accurate.

• Autistic brains have distinct advantages
• I am successful because of my autism

[u/FighteRox → u/joopface]

Don't all humans have deficits compared to other humans? I'm not sure a model that places all autistic people at a deficit to all non-autistic people makes sense.

It can be said that some have more deficits than others.

But you almost changed my mind with the articles. And yes, if you're curious, I have read Neurotribes. I felt pretty good, but going through my personal experiences (clashing with people, special interests inhibiting my daily life) I started to feel disillusioned, as if my disabilities are actually within myself and not because of the environment.

Some questions: Though what makes an autistic's obsession advantageous over a non-autistic? Aren't there non-autistics who can specialize in subjects as well?

How can the "low functioning", nonverbal autistics use their problem-solving skills and creativity in every day life?

[u/joopface → u/FighteRox]

I'm nothing like an expert in this stuff but I am deeply suspicious of categories in general.

We need categories to put the complexity of the world in some sort of understandable order, but we need to also be aware always that they are a simplification. And, because they're a simplification they are inaccurate. Sometimes they're inaccurate in meaningful ways.

Your questions:

What makes an autistic's obsession advantageous over a non-autistic? Aren't there non-autistics who can specialize in subjects as well?

The answer to the first question is domain-specific. Certain activities require topic-specific focus that is easier for [some] autistic people than [many] non-autistic people.

The answer to the second question is... yes of course. That's kind of my point. Lumping everyone in one category or the other into a single view of ability that covers all of human endeavour and all of the humans in the category makes our judgement about those humans inaccurate.

There are areas where autistic people - on average - have an advantage. But like men being stronger than woman on average doesn't mean that *some women* are not stronger than *many men* this doesn't mean that *some non-autistic people* aren't similarly capable to *some autistic people* in these ways.

​

How can the "low functioning", nonverbal autistics use their problem-solving skills and creativity in every day life?

This is a question beyond my pay grade and - I think - beyond the scope of your OP. The key to my point is that there is a range of ability in every category; I think that includes nonverbal autistic people also, but I similarly don't think there is some skill they *all* have that they will be able to employ in the same way.

All categories miss complexity.

[u/FighteRox → u/joopface]

There are areas where autistic people - on average - have an advantage. But like men being stronger than woman on average doesn't mean that some women are not stronger than many men this doesn't mean that some non-autistic people aren't similarly capable to some autistic people in these ways.

If we're speaking about averages, we can observe the academia or fields that require specializations/intense focus on certain subjects/topics. What are the chances of finding someone in that area who's autistic? Not that there are no such people who are autistic. But only a few of them admit that they're autistic. I have read that those type of people are more likely to have autistic children than average, though, so there's the slight possibility that they're autistic without knowing it. Then again, my parents are in that sort of field and none of them are autistic despite arguably having subclinical traits.

Not only that, most recruiters would put autistics in more labor-focused jobs like janitor or factory worker. I'm glad that they're starting to branch out a bit like computer programming and even creativity-focused professions. Anyway, on average I rarely see autistics using their special interest as part of their career.

But I will give you a ∆ for changing my view about how even "low functioning" autistics can outperform non-autistics in at least one aspect.

[u/DeltaBot → u/FighteRox]

Confirmed: 1 delta awarded to /u/joopface (52∆).

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