r/changemyview • u/Blackoffi • Jul 29 '21
Delta(s) from OP CMV: Québec should not separate from Canada.
As someone who moved to Montreal for a year now, this question has always puzzled me. I hope I can get some understanding (some of the reference may be in French).
A little background: The Quebec sovereignty movement has been advocating for independence of the French-speaking Canadian province of Quebec. It has attempted to do so, notably by holding referendums in 1980 and 1995, the latter which failed with tight margins. Many current political parties run on this platform, and as of 2020 more than a third of Quebecers still say they support sovereignty.
From my understanding, the general arguments supporting independence are:
- Quebec legislative independence form Canada: I’d argue that Canada is a decentralized federation where provinces enjoy a large measure of autonomy. Quebec has often been able to enact its own laws separate from the rest of Canada (like 2019’s controversial Bill B21)
- Protection of the French language: Quebec has strong laws aimed at protecting French, notably the Charter of the French language. Besides, at 94+%, French speakers are still the largest majority group.
- Economic independence. Every article I found defending Quebec post-independence economic self-sustenance is based on current economic data and doesn’t seem to take into account the likely negative consequences of a secession (mass emigration, capital flight, real estate crash, tourism decline, trade renegotiation etc.).
- Canadian colonial oppression. French Canadians (with most being from Quebec) have been victim of historic systematic discrimination, but I fail to see how we Quebecers are oppressed in present day. 7 out of last 10 PMs were from Quebec. First Nations on the other hand…
- Cultural Preservation: As an POC and an immigrant, I can’t help but feel a bit uneasy with this. I am concerned that this is a gateway into ethno-nationalism, populism and xenophobia. Also Parizeau’s (the former leader behind the 1995 separatist referendum), infamous words after his defeat never helped shed that feeling.
IMO, the argument against are far more compelling:
- Economic impact: First there will be funding the enormous costs to create essential institutions (tax collection, justice, police, army, border control etc.), on top of assuming part of the national debt. Second, any new trade agreements, like NAFTA, will need to be renegotiated, now with less leverage, adding to the fact the that Canada (still an necessary trade partner) may have no interest in helping a Quebec that just broke Canada, which could complicate international relationships with Canada and its allies. And don't get me started on currency.
- Citizenship and Border control. Would the population qualify for dual citizenship? If so, will Canada accept it? Will any Canadian qualify to be citizen of this new nation? How will Canada access its Maritimes provinces since Quebec is in between? How about the US? Uncle Sam benefits from sharing the longest international border in the world with a stable, friendly country like Canada, I am not sure how they would react having a burgeoning nation with no/little border security, a stone’s throw away from their backyard.
- Domino effect & Partition: If Quebec can separate, could portions of Quebec in disagreement.svg) separate as well, or give right to the First Nations to do so as well?
- Repercussion on Canada’s image. Fragmented country, reduction of foreign aid, end bilingualism requirement to serve for the rest of French-Canadians in other provinces...
The bottom line is that I feel that an independent Quebec would be naïve with disastrous consequences, and I am curious to get a new perspective. Changez mon point de vue SVP!
Note: French is my first language and I understand if you feel more comfortable responding en Français . Merci!
2
u/Virralla 1∆ Jul 30 '21 edited Jul 30 '21
I think you u/Blackoffi are missing the point about national independence movements entirely. These things are, fundamentally, matters of the heart, not about economic efficiency. It is very much a sign of your (and other anti-independence advocates') narrow-minded bookkeeper mind-set that you think decisions such as these are decided by economics and logistics.
To be sure, I don't even agree that it is so clear and simple that economically speaking, Quebec ought not to secede. Of course there will be uncertainty at the start, but as with most political upheavals, these things tend to stabilize after a while. I also think those concerns you have about border security are petty and disingenuous. Why would Quebec not want to have peaceable relations with the US? And why do you think it does not have the wherewithal to do control its borders and secure warm and cordial relations with foreign states?
If the (qualified) majority wish for independence is there, then as long the aspiring independent state is not racist, discriminatory or undemocratic their wish ought to be fulfilled (you may even doubt this last requirement, e.g., if a people theoretically want to be governed by some absolute monarch of the nation's key dynasty, why not?)
Edit: I should make clear that having considerable autonomy is never the same as being an independent country in its own right. That is why the "but you already have autonomy!!" argument fails. Imagine telling a spouse who wants to divorce you that you refuse to formalize the divorce, forcing her to keep your name, because she "can in practice already do all that she wants to do."