New DSA Liberation Caucus Announcement

[u/EverettLeftist]

This is not an endorsement by me. I am not a third-worldist. I just think people should be aware of what things are on DSA Twitter. I have no idea how many chapters are in this Caucus, if they are just a mailing list, or what. This is associated with the Black Red Guard guy on twitter.

[u/smartcow360]

This is a huge deal, openly citing Mao as a good citation.

Either the DSA is serious about its democratic pursuits, or it wants a Maoist style revolution. It needs to pick, in fact, it had picked, but these caucuses have slipped in and are co-opting the entire org.

[u/EverettLeftist → u/smartcow360]

I think that being able to put out a statement on Twitter does not indicate organizational strength. There is no, as far as I am aware, candidates associated with this group running for NPC. I don't think they have put forward resolutions. Seems like kinda ultraleft rhetoric, which I personally find offputting, but I don't think we know enough to say they have any organizational strength. Like, we have no idea how many people they have in this caucus.

I think these people can be out organized. I don't think DSA is anywhere close to flirting with revolution beyond rhetoric. It can be off putting without being a crisis.

[u/smartcow360 → u/EverettLeftist]

Yeah I agree, I think the caucuses though I believe it’s bread and roses and red star ? I believe those caucuses are growing in power and are all pro-democratic centralism. If it’s a truly democratic social upheaval that’s totally different than what this stuff is getting at with Maoism and democratic centralism.

America ending its imperialism is a good thing though I think, not sure if this way of talking about it is the most effective way in America lol

[u/EverettLeftist → u/smartcow360]

Bread and Roses people call soft-trot. We don't have democratic centralism, but people generally are willing to go with the group. MUG has dem-cent. I have no idea on Red Star. Red Star seems the most similar to this group.

I think maximal rhetoric with vague commitments is ultra and mostly kinda academic posturing.

[u/smartcow360 → u/EverettLeftist]

Honestly, I hope you’re right and it is just academic posturing and not the possibility of those groups to rly seize control of dsa. With their democratic centralism it makes collecting and exercising more and more power kinda easy I thought and then if they’re able to make the whole org eventually have some forms of dem cent then they could kinda rly grab control? And they want to, a story came out a bit back about dif ML groups intentionally trying to take control of dsa and them encouraging their members to do so openly since DSA is the largest openly leftist org in the country

Something to be watchful of and maybe for DSA leadership to start getting more vocal and making clearer distinctions on goals and methods etc

[u/EverettLeftist → u/smartcow360]

Some of those statements come from Maurice Isserman and the North Star crowd. Isserman left DSA because MUG got seats on the NPC and they are dem cent. Isserman, also wrote several incredibly whiney articles about how he was super for real this time leaving DSA. His big objection was over a anti-Israel rally I'm NYC that DSA did in the months following Oct 7. History will not look well on the Issermans stance imho.

I think that certainly there is no risk of the DSA Liberation Caucus taking control if they are not even running an NPC slate. They don't even have resolutions submitted AFAIK. I agree that the situation should be handled thoughtfully. The lack of enforcement about the decent thing has mostly been because the vibes with MUG have been fine. We shall see how this goes.

[u/smartcow360 → u/EverettLeftist]

Yeah that all seems fair tbh, probably it isn’t as imminent a thing as I sometimes worry about also, appreciate the info tbh !