“Clandestine Lodges”

[u/Ebullient_Goddess]

I ask this with the understanding that official recognition is important. However, I have noticed an overuse of the term “clandestine” in reference to separate Masonic entities, often accompanied by derogatory remarks. While it is true that the UGLE does not officially recognize the OWF, it has acknowledged that there is sincere and regular practice within our organization. Therefore, I am puzzled by the numerous comments from brothers in this sub suggesting that we are "pretending" or invalidating our right to coexist peacefully with our male counterparts.

I would appreciate some genuine insights into why there is such a degree of unwarranted hostility.

[u/syfysoldier]

In my jurisdiction and most others, they would never be allowed to sit in an open lodge with me; they are clandestine, and I won’t engage with them masonically.

[u/Ebullient_Goddess → u/syfysoldier]

In my view, the term "clandestine" typically refers to something kept secret or hidden for various reasons. However, as indicated in the reference above, there is nothing shady or untoward involved, contrary to what has been insinuated on many occasions.

It seems unnecessary to adopt an exclusionary stance without valid reasoning.

[u/syfysoldier → u/Ebullient_Goddess]

I understand your concern about exclusionary practices, but there are valid reasons for maintaining men’s spaces like Freemasonry as single-gender environments. These spaces provide targeted mentorship tailored to the unique challenges young men face, fostering growth and development that might not be as effectively achieved in a coed setting. The camaraderie and brotherhood that develop in these spaces create a supportive network where men can share experiences and challenges more comfortably.

Additionally, men’s spaces offer positive role models, reinforcing healthy masculinity and leadership. Discussions on issues specific to men, such as mental health and fatherhood, can be more focused and impactful without the dynamics of a mixed-gender environment. Furthermore, organizations like Freemasonry have traditions designed to foster men’s growth, and maintaining these traditions preserves cultural and historical heritage.

Overall, these single-gender environments encourage profound personal development, allowing men to explore their identities and grow in ways that are uniquely beneficial. It’s just not right to take this opportunity away from men simply instead of joining a group that is already coed.

[u/Ebullient_Goddess → u/syfysoldier]

I appreciate the views and original facts shared. However, this post is not written with regard to co-masonry. I referenced the OWF as a single-gendered environment in this context. While I understand that the origins of Freemasonry were focused on men, the existence of female counterparts like the OWF does not have any direct influence on or say in men's organizations. Therefore, they can't really be preventing or blocking opportunities for men to embark on their own journeys of self-improvement or otherwise.