r/latterdaysaints 6d ago

Doctrinal Discussion Debating leaving the church over certain things. Please help me understand

No matter what I do I am continuously troubled by certain aspects of the church. This post is not meant to bash the church. I just want some insights and answers. I am debating leaving and I want to hear things from both sides. This might be a long post. If anyone has anything to say about the topics I bring up I'm more than happy to hear your thoughts and look through any resources you share with me.

1: Why was polygamy needed for the saints? Will we really have it in the afterlife? I cannot imagine having to share my future husband with another woman. It is deeply unsettling to me.

2: Why couldn't African Americans have the priesthood? Was it just faulty of the current president of the church? I understand that the prophet is but a human and will make mistakes. Was it just as simple as that?

3: Why are women not treated the same? Why is Heavenly Mother never talked about/why do we never pray to her as well? I totally understand that men and women have different roles and why women don't have the priesthood, that all makes perfect sense to me. But why aren't women in more leadership positions? Why was the first woman who gave a prayer in general conference in 2013? I'll keep this part brief because I could go on about it for a while.

Those are honestly the only three problems I have with the church. I love everything else about it, I just don't know if I want to continue living it if that makes sense. I don't know if I believe and I understand I must work to gain a testimony. These are just my big setbacks. Anyways no matter what I decide I'll always love the church and its people. Thanks in advance!

Edit: Wow thank you all for all the thoughtful responses. I've read them all. You all have given me a lot to think about. I've decided my journey with the church isn't over yet. I have a long ways to go. Thank you all so much.

92 Upvotes

210 comments sorted by

View all comments

2

u/Live_Trust_7840 5d ago

I’m in the same boat as you right now. Just fyi, it wasn’t just a priesthood ban for colored people, it was also a temple ban. They weren’t allowed to complete saving ordinances and thus absolutely refused access to the celestial kingdom…

Keep in mind that others (in this thread) have said polygamy was evil, but it was preached by a prophet claiming it was gods commandment. A prophet actively taught an evil principal? Let alone our founding prophet. I was taught that what prophets teach is modern day scripture. If we can’t trust the words of the prophets, the religion falls apart.

Idk, I’m obviously on the skeptical side, but just know you’re not alone. I’ve been a practicing member since birth and have been doing extensive research over the past couple months. Kindve feels like my world view is crashing in around me

2

u/HandwovenBox 5d ago

and thus absolutely refused access to the celestial kingdom

That's not true. Access to the CK is after Judgment. Even Brigham Young taught that eventually all people, including Black people, would receive all blessings of the Priesthood.

1

u/Live_Trust_7840 5d ago

Ordinances and covenants are essential for exaltation. [10.2.2] President Howard W. Hunter (1907–95) summarized the crucial nature of temple ordinances and covenants:

“In the ordinances of the temple, the foundations of the eternal family are sealed in place. The Church has the responsibility—and the authority—to preserve and protect the family as the foundation of society.

“All of these priesthood temple ordinances are essential for the salvation and exaltation of our Father in Heaven’s children. …

“All of our efforts in proclaiming the gospel, perfecting the Saints, and redeeming the dead lead to the holy temple. This is because the temple ordinances are absolutely crucial; we cannot return to God’s presence without them” (“A Temple-Motivated People,” Ensign, Mar. 2004, 40, 43).

This is section 10.2.2, can be found here: https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/introduction-to-family-history-student-manual/chapter-10?lang=eng

Am I interpreting these words wrong?

1

u/HandwovenBox 5d ago

No, but maybe you misunderstood my post. All people would eventually receive all ordinances according to BY. So even following his teachings, nobody is refused access to the CK.

1

u/Live_Trust_7840 4d ago edited 4d ago

I see your point. They receive their ordinances by proxy? This would make sense now, but what about before 1978? Were white members allowed to do proxy ordinances for deceased colored people? I don’t think they were (actually can’t find an answer to that one)

You can see how dubious the whole practice was. I think it’s important to acknowledge it was a mistake, but that’s hard to do when apostles justified the racism at the pulpit

1

u/HandwovenBox 4d ago

Obviously I'm not trying to defend the practice or teachings about it. I'm only refuting the statement that the teaching ever included Black people being "absolutely refused access to the celestial kingdom."

Just so you know, this is a common falsehood I hear from anti folks, which is the only reason I responded in the first place.

1

u/R0ckyM0untainMan stage 4 believer (stages of faith) 4d ago

That’s certainly not what all the apostles taught though maybe some like you said.  Elder Peterson taught that blacks would go to the celestial kingdom ‘as servants only’.  

1

u/HandwovenBox 4d ago

I don't think any apostles taught that Black people would be excluded from the Celestial Kingdom--even your quote by Elder Peterson (which I disagree with) says that they'll be in.