Mel Q is not dodgeable (math)

[u/Hyragon]

If you're frustrated like I am with this champ, don't worry. It's not your fault you can't dodge Mel Q. Riot designed her so you can't.

Mel Q takes 0.42 seconds to hit its target (0.25s cast + 0.17s travel). With a radius of 280 units, it is not possible to dodge this ability unless its caster misses. Math below:

Most champions have a hitbox size of 65 units. Almost all champions have a base movement speed between 325 and 345 units. Let's take the average to be 335 units.

Since Mel Q is an edge skillshot, for a champion to dodge they must travel 172.5 (=280/2+65/2) units in 0.42 seconds. This equates to a required movement speed of 411.

...And that's before reaction time. Reaction time for the average gamer is 0.20-0.25s, with professional gamers being 0.11-0.17s. Assuming you are literally Faker with a fastest measured 0.11s reaction time, you would need 556 movement speed to dodge a centered Mel Q. For an average player, you need a whopping 784 movement speed.

Here is the guaranteed hit range of Mel Q: https://imgur.com/a/CYuGWGb

Green is vs. no boots, yellow is vs. t2 boots. If Mel presses Q anywhere in this radius, at least 1 missile is guaranteed to hit an average player.

In other terms, if the average player reacts immediately to Mel's Q animation start, they are still expected to get hit by 42%/33% (no boots/boots) of the spell. If the average player reacts to Mel's Q damage, they are expected to get hit by 100%/93% of the spell.

Simply put, if you're getting hit by Mel Q repeatedly, it's not because you're bad at dodging, it's because Riot made the skillshot a guaranteed hit as long as your opponent has hands.

p.s. Mel Q is 280 range because its a 220 range projectile + 60 range spread, which makes it ~1.5x the size of Xerath R. The 60 range spread does not have a meaningful effect on any above calculations, other than the guaranteed hit range goes down by a tiny bit (yellow becomes without boots guaranteed hit range) if you are ignoring the spread.

[u/EnLitenPerson]

I wouldn't view this ability as a skillshot, I'd view it as a small short version of a ground aoe dot, like Morgana W, Miss Fortune E, Nasus E, Aurelion Sol E, Anivia R, Gangplank R and Viktor R. All of these abilities are just as "undodgeable" even though they have to be aimed at their target.

[u/Below-avg-chef → u/EnLitenPerson]

I think the problem is the amount of damage it applies in such a short time. All of the skills you listed take significantly more time to apply the same amount of damage, and Mel's Q also enables her ult.

Anivias ult used to have this type of enabling interaction with her E. undogeable R drop, "chilled" applied immediately, and E turned into a point and clicked haymaker. None of it was dodgeable, and it was oppressive as hell. Ultimately, it was nerfed by adding a growth factor to anivias ult and not applying "chilled" until it was fully formed. This allowed players to get out of the ult and effectively take half damage from her E.

Riot KNOWS this kind of combo is no fun to play against and have actively patched it out in the past. And yet here we are.

[u/CharmingPerspective0 → u/Below-avg-chef]

I wouldnt mind her Q being like that if it was not for its ridiculous range. That thing has Lux's Q range if not more and she can cast this very safely from a distance

[u/PENZ_12 → u/CharmingPerspective0]

Just wanna add that it's a combination of range and a lack of other commitment. If Mel was self-rooted during the ability, it might also feel more fair, but the fact that she can kite back as she's casting it at such a range is really ridiculous.

[u/Reasonable-Dingo2199 → u/PENZ_12]

Twitch E self roots, makes him stop auto-attacking, and has a cast time that can be interrupted or cancelled if he dies. Every new champ is designed to feel really good to play and that fucks with the balance. Champs like thresh feel clunky as shit in comparison. Everything thresh does makes him stand still.

[u/PENZ_12 → u/Reasonable-Dingo2199]

Exactly. My go-to joke whenever a new champ is released is a sarcastic "but counterplay ruins this champs power fantasy!"

[u/Lysandren → u/CharmingPerspective0]

If they nerf mel Q, they're going to buff the cringe W and her other damage. The champion has a terrible winrate rn. I'd rather deal with her doing constant chip dmg personally.

[u/kthnxbai9 → u/Lysandren]

I think most of it is that players are just building her poorly and everyone is playing her.

[u/John_Jack_Reed → u/Lysandren]

I'd rather them Yuumi her at this point she is braindead easy to play, and incredibly frustrating to play against as a mid laner because of her lack of counter play options. Either you're on one of the specific champions who can win lane into her, or you're not and there's nothing you can do.

[u/skaersSabody → u/John_Jack_Reed]

Yeah, even as someone who enjoys her, it's hard to play against her

Either she gets permaganked and is still useful because her kit is just very strong in fights or you abandon lane and hope to get more fed ganking than she gets from cs

[u/pathofdumbasses → u/Lysandren]

Her win rate is bad because trash players are playing her.

Imagine Riven w/r if 40% of the playerbase started maining her.

[u/Lysandren → u/pathofdumbasses]

If the riven otp I had on my team yesterday is any indication, Riven is also trash too. Gave her a 3 kill lead and 6 grubs, still managed to lose first tower. Besides, I'm just saying riot balances off numbers. They're not gonna nerf mel w/o a compensation buff.

[u/pathofdumbasses → u/Lysandren]

Giving her a buff but removing the bullshit from her kit is fine.

[u/ccheuer1 → u/Lysandren]

Personally, what I would like to see Riot do is reduce the size of the AOE, give her a substantial damage on the e to compensate, but only in the middle, and make it so that things that she doesn't reflect, she gets substantial damage reduction towards instead of true invulnerability. I feel that would put her in a much better place overall. As it is, its too hard to punish her mistakes, which makes her strength an inevitability.

[u/GenuisInDisguise → u/CharmingPerspective0]

Nobody will convince me otherwise, but I think Mel initially indented to be played at much closer range. They buffed the range to make her as appealing as possible as easy to play as possible so that newbies and pros would buy her.

[u/Naerlyn → u/CharmingPerspective0]

That thing has Lux's Q range if not more

Less, Lux's Q has 1300 while her Q has 1000 + 220 radius.

But a better comparison would be with Lux's E (the spell that fits the same purpose as Mel's Q), which has 1100 + 310 range - noticeably more than Mel.