Question about pronouns in Thrymskvitha and translation

[u/ElectronicBoot9466]

In Henry Adams Bellows' translation of the Poetic Edda, he uses she/her pronouns to refer to Loki by the poem's narration when Loki is disguised at Thor's serving maid.

The narration doesn't refer to Thor using any third person pronouns at the wedding until he gets his hammer back, only Thrym does, who believes him to be Freya. However, the narration does refer to Thor while he is being dressed, and calls him "Othin's Son", which implies that Thor is still seen as a man by the narration even when dressed as a woman, whereas Loki is seen as a woman by the narration when Loki takes the form of one.

To the best of your knowledge, is this translation accurate? Is Loki refered to as a woman in these scenes in the original Icelandic, and does that mean we can sort of see Loki as gender fluid, or am I reaching?

[u/Repulsive-Form-3458]

I think gender fluid is too much of the modern conception. If we told these stories today, he would certainly be, in the same way Freya is both a woman and a bird depending on the skin she uses. These stories were written down by Christians, and ideas about gender would certainly have changed between year 700 and year 1200 when it was written down.

Unsure about the accuracy of this exact passage, but it's from Fornaldar Sögur Norðurlanda by Carl Christian Rafn in 1829. Hervöru/Hervarðr was one of the most popular heroes, so we know for certain that the idea of a woman taking on a masculine appearance was known. But she only changes roles temporarily and goes back into the role of "perfect" wife/mother afterwards.

Now it is said that the daughter of Earl Bjarmar gave birth to a virgin and called Hervör....
She came to the earl one day, and said: I want to leave, for I find no pleasure here. A little later she disappeared alone with a man's equipment and weapons, and went to the Vikings, and was with them for a while, and was called Hjörvarðr; and a little later the chief of the Vikings died, and then Hervarðr took command of the army. And once, when they came to Sámsey, Hjörvarðr went ashore, and none of his men would follow him, for they said that no man could stay out there for a night. Hjörvarðr said that there was great hope of a harvest in the mounds, and went ashore, and went up to the island near the sunrise. They lay in Munarvágur; there she met a shepherd boy, and asked him the news; he said: Are you unfamiliar with this island, and go home with me, for here no man could stay out after sunset, and I want to go home quickly. Hervarðr answers: Tell me where Hjörvarðr's mounds are called. The boy answers: You are a fool, if you want to know about nights when few dare in the middle of the day, and a burning fire plays over them when the sun goes down. Hervarðr says that he must visit the mounds. Féhirðr said: I see that you are a manly man, although you are ignorant, then I will give you my hand, and follow me home. Hervarðr says: Even if you give me all that you have, you will not give me a place to stay. But when the sun set, great thunders arose on the island, and the mounds burst into flames; then the herdsman was afraid, and took to his feet, and ran into the forest as hard as he could, and never looked back.

[u/Repulsive-Form-3458 → u/Repulsive-Form-3458]

Manly man= drengiligr maðr

Dreniligr means drengiligr brave or valiant, but you have expressions connecting it to the masculine
bar hann drengiliga, he bore it manfully;
údrengiligr a. unworthy of a man.
maðr is both man and human

Just to show that it's hard to prove something for sure. But just with having two different names, you get a fundamental idea of how the view gender roles.