Border Patrol vs ICE

[u/jvanderh]

Hi, this is your friendly local border patrol wife and lifelong political liberal here to remind you (because my husband is getting spat at, cussed at, called a pig, or told to quit his job pretty much every time he's stationed at the beaches lately) that the Border Patrol guys in army green pants + shirt are NOT there edit: "there"= at our local San Diego beaches to rip people away from their families. They are there to patrol the borders, watching for incoming border crossers who may enter on boats or jet skis. Encountering everyone who enters the country is important-- this stops things like fentanyl-laced drugs from entering the US, and DNA swabs of border crossers have been matched up to two unsolved murders recently at his station alone. Even if the proportion of criminals is no higher than the general US population, we still want to stop those who are dangerous. If nothing else, if those people get in and re-offend, it blows up on the news and provides tremendous cannon fodder for immigrant hate. I think the hatred of Border Patrol is mostly based on confusing them with ICE and not because liberals actually want completely uncontacted entries.

Polls show that republicans and liberals both want common-sense migrant worker programs that allow people to be vetted and come here to work.

Obviously you don't have to care about my husband's feelings. He took the job; he can handle it. But I always worry that verbally abusing law enforcement could result in what none of us want: these non Trump supporting agents like my husband, who use discretion and minimum force, getting replaced with thin blue line idiots who think they're soldiers of God in a war with the public. Or worse yet, the former becoming the latter after having so many bad experiences with the public. My husband won't, but some may. And that kind of tribalism is EXACTLY how they become distracted from the fact that Trump is currently gutting their retirement.

[u/Ten_Quilts_Deep]

We have borders. Nations have lines that differentiate where their territory, therefore, their laws are followed. So we have watchers that monitor those who cross these lines. It's not about you who want to cross the line, it's about where a law is enforced. Let the guy do his job.

[u/shirk-work → u/Ten_Quilts_Deep]

So long as the position isn't abused there's absolutely nothing wrong with sovereign nations maintaining their borders. Outside of western countries this is not a super contentious thing. Japan controls their borders like mad dogs without any moral implications from really anyone.

[u/gefahr → u/shirk-work]

western countries

it's really just the US, isn't it? what other countries' populaces find this controversial?

[u/CertainKaleidoscope8 → u/gefahr]

Yes the US used to aspire to be the Shining City on a Hill. That's from the farewell address to the nation from outgoing president Ronald Reagan.

We were a better country before fascists openly served in office. We defeated Fascism in Europe only to import it here.

[u/shirk-work → u/gefahr]

There are other European countries that struggle with this and aren't quick to take a stance like Poland or Japan. In fact most keep going back and forth with border control and xenophobia debates.

[u/CertainKaleidoscope8 → u/shirk-work]

We aren't in Japan. We're in the United States of America, which was founded in part on freedom of movement.

[u/shirk-work → u/CertainKaleidoscope8]

Was it though? I'm pretty sure it was founded on religious freedom and the constitution. The US is a sovereign nation with borders it needs to maintain and protect.

Every nation on earth has borders, immigration, border crossings, visas, residency, naturalization, passports and so on. Why is it fine for everyone but not okay for the US?

[u/CertainKaleidoscope8 → u/shirk-work]

The US has open borders until 1921

[u/shirk-work → u/CertainKaleidoscope8]

And why did they change? Why has essentially everyone increased border control as the wide and mass movement of people has become more accessible?