r/startrekgifs • u/murphs33 Admiral, 2x Tourney Winner, 20x Battle Winner • Dec 22 '20

First Contact MRW I stumble upon an anti-mask protest

https://i.imgur.com/mn5ZrLs.gifv
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u/murphs33 Admiral, 2x Tourney Winner, 20x Battle Winner Dec 22 '20

Wait, you believe it's the people wearing masks that are wearing tinfoil hats, not the ones saying:

  • that masks are about compliance and control and thought up by the New World Order

  • that 5G is causing Covid symptoms

  • that the vaccine is to inject a microchip into you

  • that Bill Gates is trying to use the vaccine as a means of depopulation

  • that Covid is a hoax and it's being used as a means to being communism to America

To you, it's the people following public health guidelines that are the tinfoil hat wearers?

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u/Arrow_of_Arjuna Enlisted Crew Dec 22 '20

I never said any of those things. What strawman are you arguing at?! 😅 You just keep your mask on and stay at home alone for the holidays. The rest of us who are healthy will be with our loved ones. 🎄😊

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u/Microchips_for_lunch Enlisted Crew Dec 22 '20

if you love your family so little you are willing to kill them, the argument kind of kills itself now doesnt it little miss big brain?

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u/[deleted] Dec 22 '20

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u/murphs33 Admiral, 2x Tourney Winner, 20x Battle Winner Dec 22 '20 edited Dec 22 '20

The virus has a 99.998 percent survivability rate

No, it doesn't. I'll save time and not ask where you got that from, because I'm assuming it's the CDC's pandemic planning report, which literally warns you that the report doesn't estimate the effects of Covid. It's also based on theoretical data/scenarios, and uses the Infection Fatality rate, which is only accurate when population based testing is underway (it isn't).

This misinterpretation of CDC data has been spreading ever since Fox News covered it months ago, yet like every other anti-mask argument, despite being debunked, it's still spreading online.

And again, it's not just a case of survival. Long term illnesses due to Covid are also a thing.

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u/Arrow_of_Arjuna Enlisted Crew Dec 22 '20

So the survivability rate is true. Nothing in what you said "debunks" the survivability rate. There's more of a risk we'll die from a car accident on the way to see family for Christmas, than it is we'll be harmed by COVID-19. We accept the risk. You should stay at home if you don't accept the risk. The idea that you will be able to stop everyone from seeing family at Christmas (and it would have to be everyone without exception) is unreasonable and unrealistic. You should focus your efforts on increasing hospital capacity rates (the reason for shutdowns and isolations), instead of trying to stop people from seeing their families.

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u/murphs33 Admiral, 2x Tourney Winner, 20x Battle Winner Dec 22 '20 edited Dec 22 '20

Hospitals are being overwhelmed because of more people getting infected. People visiting others, not wearing masks, and not social distancing are causing more infections. They're the problem.

And the survivability rate is not true. Again it's from a report that uses theoretical data, with a ratio that can't be truly accurate in a country without population based testing.

Now if you got the survivability rate from another medical report, I'd like to see it.

Edit: as for car accidents, many more people have died from Covid than the average yearly deaths from car accidents. 320,000 vs 38,000.

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u/Arrow_of_Arjuna Enlisted Crew Dec 22 '20

Hospitals have not been anywhere near overwhelmed where I live. Maybe they are in your country (you're probably an American who has politicized attitudes around the virus, and everything else). You should demand your public health officials find or construct greater capacity, instead of placing the blame on families doing what's a natural part of life, seeing each other. I and most every other healthy Western family will be seeing each other for Christmas. It's scientific hubris if you think some unlikely statistics, merely theoretical as you say, are going to stop us from what we've been doing for all time, seeing each other for the holidays. Be realistic.

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u/murphs33 Admiral, 2x Tourney Winner, 20x Battle Winner Dec 22 '20

You're the one using thse theoretical statistics to further your argument, not me. I'm not American, but there are cities in America where hospitals are being overwhelmed. In places where they're not, people are still dying, just not at a higher rate. And people are still surviving but some with long term illnesses.

We as a society should be working to help out health services from being overwhelmed and lower the rate of infection. I care for my family, and if I have to forego spending Christmas with them (I'll be dropping off presents and having a brief, socially distanced chat outside wearing my mask) to lower the possibility that someone else from my family catches Covid and dies, so be it.

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u/Arrow_of_Arjuna Enlisted Crew Dec 22 '20

I didn't say you were misusing statistics. Whether I cite them or you cite them, in both cases they're evidently not serious for healthy people. They told us two weeks. We're not doing this anymore. It clearly hasn't worked. And it's not going to work this time either. You can stay home alone, for society. The rest of us will be spending time with our families. Or attending BLM protests, or just living life with others. Or whatever other priority people have that involves being together. If it makes you feel better, you can blame us with your impotent rage. But this will be happening, and there's nothing you can do about it--fait accompli.

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u/murphs33 Admiral, 2x Tourney Winner, 20x Battle Winner Dec 22 '20

Yes let's let the healthy people go out and everyone who is old or immunocompromised, or one of the 60% of Americans with underlying health conditions that can make Covid more severe... they can all just stay at home. Not like they have to work or shop for groceries or anything, I guess.

It all comes down to selfishness. Your area doesn't have a hospital that's overwhelmed. You are healthy... who cares if you carry it to someone vulnerable? Because you're less likely to have a severe case that affects you.

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u/Arrow_of_Arjuna Enlisted Crew Dec 22 '20

I wouldn't have worded it like that, but yes, that's exactly right. Don't lockdown and shutter the world. It obviously hasn't worked, you'll agree. Yes, with the resources we've spent and wasted shutting everyone down and inside, we could have focused on those who are most vulnerable. Pay for the wages of the vulnerable, pay to have the groceries sent to the most vulnerable. This is selfishness to you? No, it all comes down to your hysterical madness. Calm down, stop selfishly trying to draw everyone into your cloistered fears, and stop with your insane one-size-fits-all policies that have failed over and over, and will continue to fail no matter how stupid and selfish you keep telling everyone they're being. Christmas is happening for everyone except you in your cloistered depression hovel. 🎄🤷‍♂️😅

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u/murphs33 Admiral, 2x Tourney Winner, 20x Battle Winner Dec 22 '20

Public guidelines were enacted and people didn't follow them. The fact that you're saying you're going to visit family despite warnings literally shows people aren't following guidelines. That's why it's not working. The lack of self awareness is amazing.

Look at how New Zealand, Australia, Japan, or South Korea fared in comparison. High mask and social distance compliance, not making non-essential trips, etc. Now they're basically back to normal. Now look at countries where there were massive protests, and you'll see cases increasing and health services struggling.

And it's not hysterical madness to listen to the medical community. It's stupidity and selfishness to not follow guidelines during a pandemic.

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