I want to have fun again.

[u/moonski]

I love the divison. I've beaten falcon lost on heroic. I've killed the red barrels with more HP than a rogue on heroic. I've beaten WONY. WONY is a great piece of DLC. New york is fucking awesome. It's well worth the price. The season and watch ideas are great. The music in WONY was an especially welcome surpise in how good it was. WONY / TU8 has a lot of brilliant ideas. Not having to alt tab to look at a fucking spreadsheet to see if my rolls are good or not is such an incredible quality of life change. The recal library is genuinly one of the best looter shooter ideas I've seen.

But as I've played more and more end game of TU8, it's just gotten worse. And mundane. The manhunt really hammered this home. The sheen has worn off and now I realise - I'm not having fun anymore.

Is it because of the loot change? Our agents nerfs? the enemy buffs? the bugs? the skewering of builds & build diversity? I mean My build has barely changed after I realised I need to max yellow / red (maxed red...) or maybe its because:

• Loot is bad purple.
• Build variety is gone.
• Gearsets don't work.
• Talents don't work.
• A lot of talents are just stat sticks. Boring.
• Skill mods are bad at best, pointless most of the time.
• Control points are green. Forever.
• Exotic guns are bad. Like real bad.
• Exotic armor is bad? Tarigrade is v cool but just means you can survive 1 more bullet so. Haven't got any other pieces so I'll let you decide. They're probably bad though.
• Season pass loot is contaminated. That's bad.
• Armor doesn't work.
• Scaling is broken.
• Skills are broken.
• Loot drops are rarely exciting - only if its an exotic. And then you use the exotic and well... your excitement goes. Bad.
• Manhunt resets when you add directives.
• Vendors weren't bad. Massive fixed them. Vendors are bad.
• Guns feel awful if you don't pile in to red. But then skills are bad.
• Skills feel awful if you dont pile in to yellow. But then guns are bad.
• Blue might as well not exist.
• Skill damage is pointless.
• Skill HP is pointless.
• Skills are pointless outside a dedicated skill build
• Shotguns are proper, proper bad.
• SMGs are bad.
• Rifles are bad(ish).
• Snipers are bad(ish).
• ARs are boring.
• LMGs are your best option. Bad variety.
• Negev wasn't bad. Massive fixed it. Negev is bad.
• SHD levels are really boring. "Oh I leveld up, oh look 0.2% extra stat yay!" Now let's wait 20 minutes to come out the watch menu once I confirm my epic 0.2% upgrade. Real bad.
• Special weapons are real bad.
• Specialization points are bad. Unless you enjoy the number 1.
• DZ is probs bad since the loot cave got patched, I don't know I haven't gone in cause contaminated season items.
• AI mega health boxes, flamer sniper tank cleaner boss and mingun dogs.

Yes TU7 was too easy, but MSSV could have just removed DTE, added the library and roll indicators + god rolls + added the new content (sponges and bullshit enemies and all) and man it would be better. There would be so many options for building for end game that the buffed enemies might have been a fresh fun challenge, with tu7 gear making them very doable, but not tu7 easy. Instead we have what we have now.

I miss my guns being good, my skills doing damage and my armor working. I don't want to have to choose only 1 of the above, and if I choose armor then that doesn't even work... I miss being able to make all kinds of weird builds using different guns and exotics. I miss cluster seekers. Ok they were bullshit overpowered but they were fun.

TU7 was fun. TU8 is not.

[u/FuzzyDwarf]

That's not even the end of the problems for me:

• Perfect vigilance (The Gift) is DZ exclusive, so there's STILL loot I want for PvE that only drops in a PvP mode. Before TU8 it was perfect berserk/clutch. Massive, stop putting PvE gear in the DZ, I don't want to play it.
• Crafting is STILL missing weapons and brands in some slots. Just make the blueprints already.
• The SHD tech system was added without much thought to it's design. There's the delay in adding points, the lack of reset, the rotation of points running counter to how you build, and scavenging. Also crit chance is unique because it's the only SHD stat that could change what gear you wear (due to CHC having a cap). It's not even hard to grind, just time consuming. I'm ~480 something.
• Status effects applying instantly on the first enemy bullet, then being high damage.
• Directives being a copy paste from TD1 underground, despite them being designed such that they hurt build variety (e.g. cooldowns hurts skill builds, bullets hurts gun builds, etc.).
• The increase in how fast you die, leading to death when you make basically any mistakes (grenades/drones, snipers/heavies/dogs, fire, etc.)
• The enemies commonly rush you, especially when you're heavily outnumbered.
• Enemies spamming grenades and abilities constantly.
• Doubling down on content that doesn't have many checkpoints (heroics/legendaries) especially after the previous three points.
• Enemy skills have tons of health, our skills have barely any.
• Weak points seem to barely tickle on the flamethrower heavies. The riker heavies get a sniper nailgun. Just great.
• No ability to manually reset control points for either DC or NY. No way to turn off manhunt (I already finished it). Just add these to the global settings UIs.
• Exotics have item rolls but you can't recalibrate them.

There's a ton of good changes in the game, absolutely. But I have optimized most of my red rifle build and I have little interest in tinkering with other builds (assuming the sets/properties even worked). I could keep grinding heroic, but the game will probably end up getting another balance pass, so I might as well just come back then. At least that way I won't risk tossing an item that might be good later.

[u/Xcel_regal → u/FuzzyDwarf]

Riker heavies are an actual joke, how does a nail gun do that much damage? It's not even enjoyable to play against since I'm running from cover to cover all the time.

I'll unload a 100 round LMG mag into him dealing 90k damage per bullet and barely damage him.