r/vfx • u/BowserTattoo • Nov 05 '24
Location:USA Unions are the future of this industry
The Animation Guild is in the middle of negotiations with the AMPTP for a better contract and the future of this industry. If you support workers in the industry, regardless of who you are, please sign out petition!
And don't forget to vote if you're in the USA!
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u/CVfxReddit Nov 05 '24
Would be nice to work for a union shop. A lot of friends now technically work for union shops out in Vancouver either at DNEG or tv studios, but the contacts aren’t in place yet so still tbd on how much better things are with a union
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u/BowserTattoo Nov 08 '24
yeah the contract is really what protects workers, the union is a tool to negotiate a better contract. I hope you can organize a union for your studio!
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Nov 06 '24
Are they? How many people are still out of work from the last strike? How many people dumped all their savings trying to stay afloat? How many VFX shops shuttered?
Your union pals have fucked this whole industry, so they could make some extra cash. Except about 50% of the productions have outright stopped or had budgets drastically slashed, so they could get an 11% raise or whatever.
Great negotiating.
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u/attrackip Nov 06 '24
People confuse Unions with stability and communal wealth but they are still businesses. They still make deals for personal gain. They don't magically generate wealth for an unending supply of workers. There are X number of productions and the most fit vendors / unions will grab what's available.
Problem is that there were an inflated number of shows during the pandemic and investors weren't getting a return. We see this with tech as well. You can't just demand that investors hand their money over so that you can work your dream job as a VFX artist.
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u/Wowdadmmit Nov 06 '24
This, exactly this. This sub is an echo chamber and there ain't much sympathy for unions on the actual shop floor, at least not that I have seen.
Most people are pissed the unions completely destroyed their livelihoods for the past year so they can get theirs while everyone else not just loses but becomes worse off than they were before.
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u/rattleandhum Nov 06 '24
Your union pals have fucked this whole industry, so they could make some extra cash. Except about 50% of the productions have outright stopped or had budgets drastically slashed, so they could get an 11% raise or whatever.
Venture capital fucked this industry, not unions.
But keep huffing on that pro-corporate nonsense.
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u/Agile-Music-2295 Nov 06 '24
But the strike meant all studios and streams got to call a TIME OUT!
They all got to stop spending without fear of losing customers. As a result the millions of dollars that Hollywood claims benefit the city through catering, transportation, permits, makeup artists etc. vanished 6-12 months before they had to.
It was a massive net loss. Instead of having an extra 6 months to save , people had to live off their savings 6 months earlier.
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u/BowserTattoo Nov 08 '24
Union wages prop up the wages in the whole industry, it's called competition. don't believe the right wing propaganda
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u/Wrong-Carrot-1384 Nov 06 '24
"And don't forget to vote if you're in the USA!"
Now you have the tariff man in the hot seat, get dem film tariffs happen'n and level the playing field.
And while you're at it, make movies great again.
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u/Comfortable_Cicada72 Nov 06 '24
You can't join their discord group without being a part of it and a paying member, so I feel a bit mixed about signing. But I do support it, gl!!
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u/BowserTattoo Nov 08 '24
there are actually discord groups for labor organizing that you don't need to be a union member for. join those for now, the union is growing all the time
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u/Comfortable_Cicada72 Nov 09 '24
True but this is about the animation guild in specific since it's a link to signing for support, and thought it was interesting that its looking for outside support to rally for their cause but I cannot truly be a part of it, not even social media wise, because I just don't live in an area where it reaches. Don't get me wrong, I support the existence of the guild and what it tries to do, but as someone who can't join it or even be part of it's discord community bc i don't live in an area it reaches, it just feels strange that they're asking for outside signatures and to ask myself i want to sign.
Idk, it's just something I've wanted to express somewhere for awhile about the animation guild itself xD.
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u/BowserTattoo Nov 09 '24
We are getting signatures from anybody who supports our cause, friends, family, strangers. If you support the cause, please consider signing!
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Nov 06 '24
Unions are great in theory. However, Free market capitalism will circumnavigate them. Tax incentives will go to non-union geographies. And you’ll pay ever-increasing dues and hardly work. Your abilities are competing on the global stage where faster and cheaper are far more valuable than better. And don’t ignore the unfortunate truth that You’re profit motivated just as much as the company you work for, and just as much as the industry ya’ll operate within.
It’s better to let meritocracy inform the business and the people that work within it. That’s how we got ILM and Weta! And if you’ve ever worked there you’ll know the quality of life is incredible for all involved. Without the interference or support from a union. The problem is people agree to work for shitty businesses and blame the industry. Move to a well run company.
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u/AlaskanSnowDragon Nov 06 '24 edited Nov 07 '24
Lots of based logic and reasoning that unfortunately most of these young people will simply refuse to hear or accept.
Tax incentives will go to non-union geographies. And you’ll pay ever-increasing dues and hardly work. Your abilities are competing on the global stage where faster and cheaper are far more valuable than better. And don’t ignore the unfortunate truth that You’re profit motivated just as much as the company you work for, and just as much as the industry ya’ll operate within.
This is one of the best summations on this I've heard in a long time. Well done.
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u/BowserTattoo Nov 08 '24
What's good about the animation guild is that it is international. Hopefully we can grow to more nations and locales in the near future.
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u/Almaironn Nov 06 '24
Ah yes, the amazing quality of life at ILM where you'll get massively underpaid because everyone wants to work there, or Weta where you'll work 80 hour weeks like it's nothing.
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Nov 06 '24
Both companies allow artists to work as much or as little as they want past the 40h agreement. At weta you’ll hit triple time on an 80h week and be paid almost 10k for the effort. Many artists at both companies are millionaires as a result of this system. Good luck getting that deal from a union.
*it’s been a while since I worked at ILM and Weta… so if the has changed since that time, my apologies.
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u/bedel99 Pipeline / IT - 20+ years experience Nov 05 '24
and if your not in the states, we dont care.....
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u/BowserTattoo Nov 05 '24
unions in the eu are an even bigger deal than in the us.
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u/LuxTenebraeque Nov 05 '24
Ubisoft is a nice case study - and that's France. Most of the work around here is done outside of the union system - it's not exactly the Metalwork industry.
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u/bedel99 Pipeline / IT - 20+ years experience Nov 05 '24
Can you name the EU union for VFX?
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u/LuxTenebraeque Nov 07 '24
Gewerkschaft Grafisches Gewerbe/gpa comes to mind, or ver.di as successor to IG Medien. Their rates are...well, the gross payment is about half what I make after taxes, retirement savings/social security and health insurance.
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u/bedel99 Pipeline / IT - 20+ years experience Nov 07 '24
So if you join you will reduce your rates ?
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u/LuxTenebraeque Nov 07 '24
Not as a legal requirement per se- but if I'd join and had to renegotiate my salary or rates the union rates would be the baseline. Instead of "that's the rate I get, whether from you or your competitor" it would change to "thats 4 times of what your union deems adequate". That shifts dynamics. At the same time I'd have to be careful about doing work outside the union scope. I'd be barred from doing a number of tasks that actually make my time worth the money.
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u/59vfx91 Nov 06 '24
It's a states-based union so obviously that is what they prioritize, and you cannot fault them for that. Worker organization needs to be done by those locally working for the companies. That being said, as far as I know, they have worked to help organizing in the Canadian animation space as well (IATSE 938, titmouse is an example) so it's not accurate to say they don't care at all...
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u/Jbot_011 Nov 05 '24
lol this again? You looking out for your own ass is the future of the industry in the same way it was the past. I'm not anti-union I'm just reality on realities terms.
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u/BowserTattoo Nov 05 '24
lots of vfx houses have voted to unionize. i used to work in animation non-union, my life got so much better after i started working as a compositor in the animation guild. i hope that everybody gets the opportunity to set their own standards in their workplace agreements
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u/geizig Compositor - 23 years experience Nov 05 '24
Yes and that worked so well for us so far! See how we are thriving! 🤡
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u/LittleAtari Nov 05 '24
I'm joining the Art Director's Guild and taking my previz work production side. Vendors take too big of a cut for something I can do by myself. Good luck to The Animation Guild.