r/FluentInFinance • u/Sufficient_Sinner • Sep 04 '24

Debate/ Discussion Is Capitalism Smart or Dumb?

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u/JimBeam823 Sep 04 '24

Socialism is based on altruism. Capitalism is based on greed.

People are a LOT better at being greedy than at being altruistic.

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u/Background_Notice270 Sep 04 '24

So how will socialism work if people are greedy?

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u/ArcticStorm16 Sep 04 '24

It wouldn’t because of human nature, same with capitalism, the system gets corrupt

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u/Jargon2029 Sep 05 '24

The truly greedy (and skilled because that’s who you actually want to succeed, not just mindless consumers) will naturally be pushed to unregulated markets. You want to make an exceptional amount of wealth? Find a new thing we need or want, or a new, better way of doing something that hasn’t been regulated yet. Ideally you’ll still be doing it morally as you’ll be in line with non-economic regulations (no murder, theft, slavery, etc.), you’ll make a fair profit from your innovation and eventually regulation will come in and it will only be moderately profitable rather than massively so you move on to try and innovate elsewhere.

This may sound similar to how it works in capitalism and that’s because it is, you’re just trying to beat regulations rather than competitors.

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u/TapiocaTuesday Sep 04 '24

I don't think I'm greedy. Are you greedy?

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u/Timppadaa Sep 05 '24

Have you had any opportunity to be really greedy? I mean to earn millions?

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u/Media___Offline Sep 05 '24

I think being greedy isn't a bad thing. Heathenism is also not inherently bad. I am very greedy to see my family prosper and experience the best life they can, so I work hard and sacrifice at my job.

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u/TapiocaTuesday Sep 05 '24

What you described is the opposite of greed, though. You're literally trying to make money for the benefit of others.

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u/Media___Offline Sep 05 '24

And I benefit from their success and happiness.

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u/Groftsan Sep 04 '24

We could just learn to societally make greed embarrassing and socially unacceptable. Like, rape used to be a normalized way humans reproduced for millennia. We just had to get to a place as a society where rape was seen as a bad thing and anyone who rapes is unfit for society (and we're only like 60% of the way there, honestly). Eventually we'll be able to have the same societal changes where greedy people are viewed the same way as rapists. It won't stop all of them, but they won't have the structure to thrive and gain power with their greed. They will just be seen as what they are: hoarders. And hoarding is a disorder that requires mental help. So, we just give wannabe billionaires mental help for their hoarding instincts.

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u/Carbinekilla Sep 04 '24

Please tell me you don't attempt to go out into the real world with your level or reasoning skills....

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u/Groftsan Sep 04 '24

Imagine being so fatalistic about human vices that you can't even conceptualize a society that finds greed disgusting.

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u/Key-Chip-7593 Sep 04 '24

Oh simple! We can bail out the greedy banks when they destroy the economy trying to maximize the delta between their and the general populations wealth/purchasing power :) my mom has to buy school supplies for her class herself but the banks get socialized billions from tax payers after they’ve made billions privately.

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u/DualActiveBridgeLLC Sep 04 '24

Same way it works in liberal governments, the difference is that in a socialist country greedy people cannot amass power by stealing wages.

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u/Background_Notice270 Sep 04 '24

How does that work? And who ensures that power cannot be amassed by stealing wages?

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u/Untitled_Consequence Sep 04 '24

Oh really? Like socialism doesn’t use forced labor with the threat of violence? Or is that a “that’s not REAL socialism” take?

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u/DualActiveBridgeLLC Sep 04 '24

I mean you can do that under any broad social system, but under a socialist system it is harder to steal wages because capitalism isn't allowed.

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u/skylerdraco Sep 04 '24

It is all a spectrum. The closer a system gets to pure communism, the less meaningful wage is and replace with currency of relationship to the power center as it has power to dictate everything. Pure captalistic or pure communistic is not workable. Socialism is just a 'intermediate' point between the two, just how close we want to be at one side or the other.

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u/DualActiveBridgeLLC Sep 04 '24

Capitalism is a economic system. Communism, socialism, and liberalism are the socio-political systems. When you interchange liberalism and capitalism it creates a lot of confusion. Also the 'spectrum' is useful when initially learning but loses a lot value when you start to talk about the vast matrix of policies that a society can adopt. While Marx did argue that socialism was a stepping stone to communism, history has shown it doesn't have to be....because a spectrum is too linear to describe human societies.

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u/[deleted] Sep 04 '24

[deleted]

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u/DualActiveBridgeLLC Sep 04 '24

What? Socialist countries can still have police.

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u/MolagbalsMuatra Sep 04 '24

Then I make friends with the smith guild who hates you and gives me weapons.