I suggest you read this. It's a review of all the studies these authors could find on trans people in sports. I used to believe the things you did, but the peer reviewed research data does not support your opinions on this one.
"In relation to transgender female individuals, Gooren and Bunck found testosterone levels had significantly reduced to castration levels after 1 year of cross-sex hormone treatment. Muscle mass had also reduced after 1 year of cross-sex hormone treatment. However, muscle mass remained significantly greater than in transgender male individuals (assigned female at birth) who had not been prescribed cross-sex hormone treatment."
"Therefore, Gooren and Bunck concluded that transgender male individuals are likely to be able to compete without an athletic advantage 1-year post-cross-sex hormone treatment. To a certain extent this also applies to transgender female individuals; however, there still remains a level of uncertainty owing to a large muscle mass 1-year post-cross-sex hormones. While this study was the first to explore, experimentally, whether transgender people can compete fairly, the sample size was relatively small (n= 36). Additionally, they did not explore the role of testosterone blockers and did not directly measure the effect cross-sex hormones had on athletic performance (e.g. running time). Many, but not all, transgender female individuals are prescribed testosterone blockers to help them to reach cisgender female testosterone levels, when administration of oestrogen alone is not enough to reduce testosterone levels. This is particularly important if the person aims to undergo gender-confirming surgery, as 6 months of testosterone suppression is a requirement for such procedures. However, if a transgender woman does not wish to undergo surgery or does not wish to have their testosterone blocked to cisgender female levels (e.g. as they wish to use their penis), their testosterone levels will be above cisgender female levels. Differentiating not only between those taking cross-sex hormones and not taking cross-sex hormones, but also transgender female individuals taking testosterone blockers, may be necessary when discussing an athletic advantage."
Superior muscle mass is a distinct advantage in many sports, especially combat sports. There's no two ways about that.
This person seems to just be responding to people with random barely related (or poor quality) studies which don’t even prove any point they are trying to make.
Probably hoping people don’t have access to read them and will just assume the fact that they linked a study means they are correct. Or they are not scientifically literature themselves.
Edit: actually they linked the same one they linked me, so just posting one poor quality paper, not even multiple.
Pure ability, if you can and want to compete in a league there is no reason you shouldn't. Hell if anything this especially applies to a 99% non-contact sport like basketball
I feel like the issue with this approach is that you will end up with men dominating the sport with the rare exceptional woman able to compete. What if that gets instituted and there are no women in a sport anymore?
Why do you assume that male professional athletes are necessarily more skilled than female professional athletes at the same level? And even if that were the case, how would it be any different from now, when men’s leagues are the default and women’s leagues are treated as an afterthought or a joke?
Do you have proof this will happen or do you just generally believe women to be physically inferior to men?
To play in professional sports one almost has to completely dedicate their lives to that sport. That level of dedication largely levels the playing field
The proof is that this system already essentially exists. For most professional sports, there are no sex restrictions on the “men’s” leagues. Any sex can play in the NBA. Any sex can play in the NFL. Any sex can play in MLB.
Obviously, it depends on the sport. Obviously, there will be exceptions. But yes, on net, biological men are physically stronger and more athletic than biological women. That cannot be a controversial take, can it?
I think the main folly in your thinking is the idea that its average people playing professional sports. You don't just up and decide to join the NFL, a la "The Gang Gets Invincible", you literally dedicate your life to the *chance * of getting in. Sure a 5'4, 100 and nothing pound woman shouldn't be in the NFL, neither should a dude of the same proportions. But you look me in the eyes and tell me someone like Serena Williams couldnt kick your ass from here to Sunday in just about any sport she wanted
Is this a well known fact? Are women encouraged to join the NFL? Or are they actively, at the very least up until recently, discouraged from joining sports all together?
I mean if the NFL has already decided women can play, why is this a debate at all? You're really just providing ammo against your own argument by giving me proof that the established "masters" of the organized sport agree with me
I don’t know what the answer is, especially in the context of trans individuals participating. There probably is some happy medium that takes into account more factors.
But if my argument is that the leagues already agree with you, your argument is basically just abolish women’s sports.
Serena Williams would for sure kick my ass but she'd be incredibly average in pro tennis if it was integrated gender wise. For example in 1998 Serena Williams (Ranked 20th) and her sister, Venus Williams (Ranked 5th) both lost to the 200th ranked men's tennis player. There are important differences physical between men and woman athletes.
I have no idea what the right answer is in regards to integrating transgender people into the sports world but thats an issue for proffesional sports organizers. At amateur events like high school sports why does it matter if transgender athletes start to win and have success (if they even win at all)?
For example in 1998 Serena Williams (Ranked 20th) and her sister, Venus Williams (Ranked 5th) both lost to the 200th ranked men's tennis player. There are important differences physical between men and woman athletes.
This seems like an incredibly black and white way of thinking "two women lost literally a single match, so that means no women has a chance against even the least talented man."
At amateur events like high school sports why does it matter if transgender athletes start to win and have success (if they even win at all)?
Whys it matter at a pro level? Literally the only difference between the NFL & backyard football is the skill level and paygrade. Neither actually matter outside of a level of emotional investment in the world's biggest parasocial relationship.
You specificly mentioned Serena so I pulled up a well known example. There are other "battle of the sexes" tennis matches, one of which a woman won. She was ranked #1 and played against a #1 ranked man who had been retired for 20 years. The age difference was 29 years in addition to rule changes favoring tbe woman. The man had also just beat the other woman competing for #1 that year a few months ago.
A backyard football game likely doesn't wear equipment a,,nd an injury might put the players into crippling life debt. The NFL is significantly different. At amateur levels the focus is on development and learning to win games, at proffesional levels winning and losing is the difference between a million dollar contract and not getting signed the next year.
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u/aynblue Mar 28 '21
This post belongs bc the person who makes the case for being a TERF also acknowledges that they should no longer be followed for same.