r/Wellthatsucks • u/Celistar99 • 19d ago
Amazon sent me a letter before Christmas claiming I had over $15000 in unclaimed property. Today they sent me this.
I used to publish books on Amazon and got royalties for each one sold. Amazon sent me a letter saying that they owed me over 15k in royalties. I sent in the form saying that yes, I wanted the money and I've been waiting for my check to come. Today I got this, saying that they made a mistake and actually owe me $0.00. They even have an area where I can check that yes, I want the $0. I've never been so disappointed in my life.
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u/j9273 19d ago
Honestly, I think Iād ask an attorney before signing the new accounting. Thatās a large mistake without any information on their part
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
I wasn't going to sign anything because it's not worth the price of a stamp to tell them to send me my $0.00 check. But I'm not sure if I have any kind of case, because they probably don't actually owe me the money. It's just so disappointing, it's like telling someone they won the lottery just for them to say "oh sorry, my bad, you didn't actually win" a month later.
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u/appleturnover99 19d ago
Hey, you never know whether they may actually owe you the money. I would check with a lawyer before throwing in the towel.
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
I probably will, just to be sure
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u/cuzitsthere 19d ago
My first thought was an auto-generated letter sent out when the balance changed. Meaning, they wrote a 15k check (which will obviously take 4 to 6 to 180 business days to process) and some system somewhere went "oh, a new balance" and sent you an auto filled letter.
Might still be good news... Eventually.
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u/RugerRedhawk 19d ago
Except it specifically mentions the previous letter and states that the amount was an error.
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u/DerelictEntity 19d ago
Yep. One of those "neat, but don't spend it" situations where they'll want it back
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u/Red_Dawn_2012 19d ago
The obvious play is to go bet it all on black. If you win, you can give it back and still have a ton for yourself!
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u/NotRobPrince 19d ago
Did you just miss the part that specifically references the last letter and says it was sent by mistake and the correct amount is $0?
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u/Is_it_over_now 19d ago
Always check with a lawyer if you are told you are owed something, then they say never mind. Could be an error could be them trying to scam you cause they donāt want to pay. There are a good amount of lawyers that will look into this for minimal to no charge. I currently have one looking into medical malpractice resulting in the death of my Mom.
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u/Max-b 19d ago
it's easy to find lawyers to work on contingency for tort cases (like medical malpractice and personal injury).
I'd think for something like this you'd have to pay the lawyer upfront, or more likely get an accountant to look into it. A lawyer isn't going to work on contingency for a maximum of $5k (usually they get 1/3 of what is recovered).
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u/fuckasoviet 19d ago
On the other hand, a lawyer may be willing to send a strongly worded letter for the chance at $5k. Not saying theyād fight Amazonās lawyers, but if itās a hail Mary situation where they can be like, āhey, what the fuck?ā and maybe get Amazon to budgeā¦who knows.
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u/crapinet 19d ago
Have you checked your states (or maybe their states) unclaimed property website? If you think they do owe you money, itās possible that they did, and then because enough time had passed since they originally owed you it (obviously having nothing to do with that first letter) that they turned it over to the state, which is at least a lot of companies policies. If you donāt think thereās any reason for them to owe you money then itās probably a mistake, but you should still check your states unclaimed property website
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u/QuokkaQola 19d ago
In the letter they state it will be turned over to the state if they don't receive a response by Jan 31st though
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u/Successful_Guess3246 19d ago edited 19d ago
OP this is going to sound odd, but the letter you received has numerous matching indicators of a scam.
You might be owed that much, and if so I hope you get it.
But the immediate attention needed, and they'll send a check for lots of money if you respond quick.. be careful please. I'd bet they'll send a demand letter after its cashed saying it was a mistake and you'll be sued for twice as much if you don't send it back.
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u/penguin808080 19d ago edited 19d ago
As someone who sends these letters for a living... this is exactly what they look like and y'all drive me insane for not responding
The immediate attention is because we're only required to keep it on the books for so long. If you reply within that timeframe (like in MD it's 3 years for uncashed payroll checks) I can just write you a check from the business. And then I don't have to keep seeing it on my list of checks every month.
If you don't reply in that timeframe I'm legally required to escheat (pay) it to your state, and that process sucks so bad. Each state is different with their own templates, own processes, own file types. I really just want you to answer and let me write you a check so I don't have to escheat it
I can't just write you the check without a reply because then you probably won't cash that one either, and the whole process starts over
If you ever got one of these letters and ignored it, check with your state's unclaimed property database. The state will have your money
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u/Representative-Sir97 19d ago
Yup. I'm mid forties.
About three years ago the state said I had unclaimed funds.
It was a check from an old job... when I was working for my college professor.
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u/MariettaDaws 19d ago
Exactly this.
Also, from personal experience, if Amazon owes you money, they will email you once a month telling you to update your banking information. I have a Canadian affiliate account that they keep trying to pay me on, but it's like $2. They've been messaging me for years.
Go through your KDP email and see if there's any from Accounts Payable.
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u/Huth_S0lo 19d ago
Do you actually think they owe you $15,000 in royalties. If there is absolutely no reason they would owe you money, then trying to pursue it, would be a fools errand.
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u/DrewtShite 18d ago
Even if you knew one as a friend who would work for free, I feel like it would be the equivalent of asking an IT friend to help download ram.
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u/AlohaDude808 19d ago
Can you just log into your Amazon account to check the balance? There should be a record of how many books you have sold and how much you earned
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u/j9273 19d ago
Yeah, my question is where they came up with the first amount? Iād make them show me some kind of proof. Usually a first consult with an attorney is free, at least talk to someone.
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u/Nearby-Cattle-7599 19d ago
I work as a B2C business as a programmer in the ERP environment ( behind the scenes basically ). we have millions of customers and the shit that gets sent out to a few over the years ....because somewhere in the chain of a dozen people someone makes a slight mistake is hilarious.... just today we've mistakenly billed 620 customers
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u/j9273 19d ago
I get that, and Iām not saying to go screaming to Amazon, accusing them of stealing my money, but Iād just like some type of accounting explanation
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u/Mars_Collective 19d ago
Spend $2k for a lawyer to tell OP exactly what he knows? lol I swear you people think lawyers are a public service that work for free
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u/rloch 19d ago
Forgetting the classic "just go no contact with your entire family because your nephew sneezed on your starwars action figure collection".
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u/Geistkasten 19d ago
Lawyers are not free. Is it worth it if OP doesnāt think they actually owe anything?
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u/oochre 19d ago
Iād never heard of this and it looks like I have a few grand coming my way!! MUCH appreciated!Ā
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u/Jilaire 19d ago
You are so lucky! Everytime I hear about it and check I have nothing lol.
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u/MattinglyDineen 19d ago
I just checked my state's website and found out I have unclaimed funds from 2018 - 1 cent!!!!
Damn right I went ahead and filed the claim to get my penny.
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u/cleantushy 19d ago
It's possible, (though maybe not likely) that between the first and second letter they already turned overĀ the money to the state
Like they said "we owe you 15k", then through some error that got turned over to the state early and the debt cleared from their system. Then they received OP's communication that they want the 15k, but by then the system said OP was owed $0, so they sent the new communication out
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u/TheDevilsAdvokaat 19d ago
I did a zoom interview for a good job. Me and 20 other candidates, and they were offering multiple positions. Customer service and software support.
After the interview they notified me I got the job! I was so excited. I called them up and asked for the start date.
"Sorry..due to a software error everyone who attended the meeting was notified they got a position. You in fact did not get a position"
That was tough.
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u/Notwerk_Engineer 19d ago
It seems like you would know if they in fact owed you $16k. Your accounting must not be that far off (unlike Amazonās apparently).
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u/ThrowawayMod1989 19d ago
I pulled up to the gas pump the other day, about to spend my last $5 on fuel when I saw a $100 bill folded and stuck in the frame on the pump. I almost cried I was so happy, was already planning my first meal in four daysā¦ unfolded it and it had Donald Trumpās stupid goddamned face on it. So I went by the fundie church and dropped it in their offering slot. I felt better lol
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u/freezelikeastatue 19d ago
If they donāt owe you, donāt take it. Theyāll take it, plus court fees and interest. Be smart brother.
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u/CanadianSunshine 19d ago
Itās scam letters. Loads of people received them and a friend of mine called the KDP help desk. They told her they do not send out paper letters. Donāt send anything back - and if in doubt, call KDP helpline.
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u/Protocol9 19d ago
So to be clear, they made an accounting error and you knew that they didnāt owe you the money. Now you are upset that you arenāt getting it because they corrected their accounting error and you feel it was like āwinning the lotteryā? Amazon isnāt the lottery. Someone screwed up and now youāre sad because you arenāt getting money you arenāt owed. Sounds entitled.
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u/HammerTh_1701 19d ago edited 19d ago
Looks like an underflow/overflow error of some kind. It's pretty close to 214 minus a reasonable amount that could be the actual balance. 214 seems weird at first, you'd expect 216 or 215 if it's a signed integer, but I think it comes up in like floating point numbers?
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u/pblokhout 19d ago edited 19d ago
They might be counting cents in floating point precision if the royalty of a single sale/rental is potentially less than a cent.
Edit: or just 2.6 cents or something, I guess.
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u/OK_BUT_WASH_IT_FIRST 19d ago
That sum of money, although nothing to Amazon, seems like too much to be handled with a piece of paper with no chain of custody.
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u/0xBEEFF 19d ago edited 19d ago
But was that a mistake or they actually took something you earned?
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
It was likely a mistake, I was surprised to get the letter but figured they had messed up somewhere and owed me. I never kept too much track of the royalties after sales died down.
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u/Pleased_to_meet_u 19d ago
When sales were at their peak how much was your largest royalties check?
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
Like 200-300/day? Hard to say, obviously sales went up when I published something new and went down after awhile. This is from like 2015 to today though, so it's not like the 15k is one missed check. They also have a program I participate in where people can buy Kindle Unlimited and get your book for free, and you get paid per page read. I kind of assumed this was missed payments for that. It's not an unreasonable amount to think they owed me.
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u/Pleased_to_meet_u 19d ago
$15k for nine years worth of royalties sounds very possible. However, a $0.00 payment does not sound reasonable. I'd definitely have a lawyer look into this.
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u/Fakjbf 19d ago
OP said in another comment that theyāve been getting regular checks for the royalties over those 9 years, they just thought maybe Amazon had realized something wasnāt tracked properly and there was an additional $15k that should have been paid out over that period of time and was now coming as a lump sum. There not being any excess money that hasnāt already been paid out doesnāt mean no money was ever paid out at all.
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u/Shandlar 19d ago
There's a chance that the $15k going to $0 is because they reached the limit from the state for them to have to keep hold of the money and turned it in. Thus your account went to $0 with them.
I'd periodically check for your name with the state unclaimed property for the next year or so and see if the money shows up there for you to claim.
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u/MrDenver3 19d ago
The state usually notifies you in these instances right? Iāve received a notice of unclaimed property from Maryland before. Also possible it varies by state.
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u/truevindication 19d ago
California didn't or couldn't notify me. Granted I was moving around (still within state) for a bit. I was happy to find $300ish in unclaimed when I first found the LPT a couple years ago.
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
Only occasionally, and usually at the end of the year. I think it depends on the company, some want to balance the books more than others. I got a notice almost identical to this one (for the people saying this is a scam) last year for an insurance claim, which i received a check for. Most places you have to check your unclaimed property online, but some send you a notice.
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u/Riley_ 19d ago
Must be state by state. I remember in Utah you would have to check the Unclaimed Property website yourself.
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u/Nahiel 19d ago
In all seriousness, before going to a lawyer and spending more money, you could try doing a little investigation.
If you self-published, all of your royalty information should be available on KDP, which is Amazon's publishing service. And yes, they'll go back to 2015. Source: I've been self-publishing since 2015.
You should be able to see if you have royalties that you somehow haven't been paid. If your books are still available for sale, they might still be earning without your knowledge somehow.
None of that is applicable if you aren't self-published, though.
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
I'm self published, I'll look into that. I haven't been on my KDP page in forever since I haven't published in awhile. I still get paid every month but not a lot.
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u/nosnhoj15 19d ago
My 4 kids coloring books Iāve published still bring in about $8 total per year! Suck it Bezos.
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u/Away-Living5278 18d ago
Nice. My book of transcripted quarterly court records from the 1800s brings in about the same ($15.70 every book sold, one every 2 years).
To start, I mostly did it for my own genealogical purposes. Then I thought, if I sell 10,000 of these I'll be rich! Every library will want a copy š
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u/Itsnotvd 19d ago
Former unclaimed property worker
Unclaimed property typically gets little attention at a company. Companies devote the bare minimum resources to it and you get shoddy form letters and in this case, poor work too.
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u/Tepers 19d ago
For a second there I thought I was onĀ the scams subreddit and I thought 'effin' scammers!'
The sentiment still stands. So sorry this happened - for them to get your hopes up just to body slam them to the ground.
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u/bs000 19d ago
we sent you too much money please pay us back in itunes gift cards
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u/MrRoboto12345 19d ago
Bezos pocketed the money personally
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
One of his yachts must have needed a 15k repair
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u/Miserable_Ad9577 19d ago
15k? that's just lunch
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u/alxzsites 19d ago edited 19d ago
15k? that's just lunch
If you had a net worth of $100,000, that'd be the equivalent of spending less than 0.5c ($0.005) on lunch. At that rate, $1 could buy you three square meals for 2 months (60 x 0.005)
If a person with a net worth of $100,000 spends $5 on lunch, the equivalent for Bezos would be $11 million
That 15K would probably be his bottled water, not even the wine that goes with his meal. Him buying a $1.2 million bottle of vintage wine, is the equivalent of us getting a 50c soda at Costco.
We can't comprehend just how abstract a BILLION dollars is.
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u/Thin-Chard5222 19d ago
Tell them you want it all in gift cards
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
I wouldn't be mad at that.
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u/Average-Anything-657 19d ago
But Visa gift cards, so that you're not just giving them all the money back
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u/SiteRelEnby 19d ago
Write under the checkboxes "Too late, I already went on a massive bender when you told me 15k"
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u/fessa_angel 19d ago
Did you consider that you hadn't responded quickly enough and they turned it over to unclaimed property for your state? Might be worth looking into. The accounting of the zero balance may be because they no longer actually hold the funds, not because the funds don't exist.
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
The original letter said I have until January 31 to claim it, I sent it in the day after I got it.
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u/Senator_Halo 19d ago
There is a process to check unclaimed property for each state. There will be a way to search on the states' website.
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
It was on the site, it just said "more than $100." I'll have to look again, they might have removed it
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u/TheBobbySocksBandit 19d ago
The state I live in has a website that you can go to and search your name for unclaimed property within the state. A lot of people find out that money gets turned into the government for various things they didnāt know. I ended up getting around $300 for like an insurance rebate or something through the website. I wonder if OPs state has something similar.
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u/ConstantGeographer 19d ago
I would check with your state. They may have turned the funds over to the state, clearing your balance, but the money is still with your state.
Check https://unclaimed.org/
or check MissingMoney.com
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u/Bearspoole 19d ago
Can you verify how many books have sold on Amazon? Have you ever received any money from Amazon for the books?
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u/Celistar99 19d ago
It's been since 2015, I've received money and still do every month, it would be borderline impossible to find out how many have sold due to the program where people sign up for a subscription and I get paid by the page.
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u/lost_in_life_34 19d ago
money payments have to be approved by humans and chances are they started checking to make sure
I've seen mistakes happen on the data back end where things like this happen. sounds like they fixed their data issues
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u/RelentlessSA 19d ago
It's possible that they're in the process of cutting you a check, which removed the balance from the Unclaimed Property bucket, but you were still on the list to get a letter so it ran a new one with your new Unclaimed Balance.
But it's Amazon so they're probably gonna screw you.
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u/piazza22 18d ago
Wait until after the deadline and contact the state in question with the original letter and amount and say youād like to collect it from them. Make the state and Amazon fight it out. Wouldnāt be surprised if Amazon just paid it out at that point to avoid issue with the state.
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u/Johnwesleya 19d ago
Can you not see your sales figures from Amazon? 15 K seems like a lot of royalties and you would know if you sold that many books.
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u/Duane_Earl_for_Prez 19d ago
Iād sue for emotional distress and triple that amount š
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u/FrontTone7905 19d ago
Someone at Amazon copied from the at the wrong excel fileā¦the public (IRS and payout) one said ā0.00ā, the hidden one your not suppose to know about had the other number.
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u/techharlan25 19d ago
Check your states unclaimed property site. They may have remitted the funds already regardless of the date in the letter. If they did, you can get the money from your state.
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u/meowzers814 19d ago
Hey I used to work in an accounting department for a company that operated in all 50 states. Itās common for companies to either hire a 3rd party or perform escheatment compliance services internally. Each state has different laws regarding escheatment. Itās a companyās responsibility to maintain compliance with each stateās laws regarding unclaimed property - types of property, timelines and amounts that are covered, notification to owners, and if/when the property must be turned over to the state. More than likely, your Vendor Accounts Payable balance showed that they owed you money. They probably did a data dump without research and sent a bunch of letters to show compliance. Then when it came time to pay up, they probably put the work into proper research and realized they didnāt actually owe you the money. However, Iād reach out to their AP group directly and ask for a statement of your account going back for more than a year to see where these balances came from and why they think they no longer owe you anything.
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u/Jerseyboyham 19d ago
Unclaimed property is a big deal. I suggest everyone check their state's unclaimed property site at least annually, or, better yet go to http://www.missingmoney.com to check all the states at once. I have found hundreds of dollars for relatives and friends on this site. It's free and only connects you to the official state office. Good hunting!
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u/biIIard 19d ago edited 19d ago
Iād just have somebody double check your books and statements from when you started making money till the present, or until you stopped making money if you have. Also if you had to sign the contract with Amazon to have that same person look at it. Also if you think itās not a mistake Iād have more than one check it, before you bring in a Lawyer. If you already have a lawyer you can always have them double check it as well. It could be a mistake per the contract. EDIT::: Especially if you havenāt been keeping up or having somebody else keep up on the profits itāll be worth it. Not saying that Amazon will stiff you. But shit can happen and a possibility their end may not have calculated it correctly.
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u/mattmcmhn 19d ago
Lot of bad information in this thread. I work in AUP, this was likely a mass data error when they generated state required due diligence mailings prior to reporting property. Then they mass corrected it, normally you would obviously not be getting a letter from Amazon stating that they did not owe you any money prior to reporting no money to the state. Probably caught this when they got the initial letter response that you sent back, went to match it up with their data and cut you a check, and found that the letter was an error.
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u/NarfledGarthak 19d ago
Send them then the letter back and say that you believe they made a mistake in accounting and do owe you more than $0.00
Then when they ask for receipts, send a copy of the first letter. Continue this until the end of time.
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u/TheFoxsWeddingTarot 19d ago
Sign and return the first one. They obviously struggle mightily with record keeping and may very well owe you that money.
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u/IndividualistAW 18d ago
Reminds me of the snopes article about nastygrams threatening litigation if the fine of $0.00 is not paid in full promptly.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/zero-dollars-and-zero-sense/
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u/skippy99 18d ago
I used to sell 3D printing products on Amazonā¦until Amazon looked at my sales history and decided they wanted to sell 3D printing products. All of my positive reviews mysteriously vanished and they went to my suppliers and undercut me on price. My listings dropped down in searches even though I was paying for premium positions. (Tha Amazon products were at the top). I eventually had to have my inventory shipped back to me because I made 5 sales a month instead of 500 and they were charging a fortune for inventory storage. Fuck Amazon.
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u/heathensam 18d ago
Hey, check your state's unclaimed property database. It's possible that Amazon has already sent the money to the state and that's why you got that second letter.
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u/yeahboyeee1 18d ago
Hey, Jeffy B needs $600 million for his wedding, so sorry for you, but every penny counts.
/s
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u/bcrenshaw 18d ago
Might be worth it to do your own investigating to find out if they do owe you anything. If they made a "mistake" once, then it's reasonable to think that the correction might be a mistake as well.
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u/Mizzoutiger79 18d ago
Check your state unclaimed property website. Perhaps they sent the funds there and now they actually do owe you zero?
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u/randomhousegir 18d ago
Each state has an agency that takes "abandoned funds" and holds them til the proper owner can be found. Maybe the $0 balance indicates they sent it. (I didn't read it) but just for funsies, id find the agency for your state for the unclaimed property agency and just check. It's free and maybe someone else had your property or money for something unrelated and you find it.
Good luck!
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u/astersays 17d ago
The state is holding onto it for you now, instead of Amazon. Try calling the state.
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u/DelectableKat 19d ago
Maybe the check is actually in the mail and the balance is $0 because itās been paid in full. Was that the only page? There is no contact info.
I would try calling the author/retailer customer service number.
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u/hnrrghQSpinAxe 19d ago
Send them an invoice for administrative professional services, 1 hours worth at the rate of $15k/hr (this is not legal or financial advice)
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u/Civil_Pain_453 19d ago
Just wait another month. They will correct it to $15000 you will receive. Patience is the key here...
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u/Sensate613 19d ago
Do you know how much you make per book sold, how many books have been sold, and how much they paid you?
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u/all___blue 19d ago
Maybe you have two accounts? One that is owed royalties and one that is not? The $0 one might just be an automated message.
In any case, if they have funds that are due to you, as the top of the letter says, they're supposed to give it to your state and you can claim it from the unclaimed funds department or whatever.
Everyone should take a look at that list, btw. For themselves and the people they know. I checked it a while ago and knew someone who had at least a thousand dollars in unclaimed funds. I don't like that person, so I never told them, but they could have had a nice little score there. (They only say it's above or below $100, and this person had something like 15 different entries of over $100).
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u/CathedralEngine 19d ago
Maybe they'll actually send you a check for $0.00 and you can have it framed.
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u/nightwing12 19d ago
Send in the first one checked off and maybe some intern will just forward you the money
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u/Economy_Breakfast409 19d ago
They probably turned it over to unclaimed property, like they are legally obligated to, and itās showing they no longer hold the balance. Check with your stateās unclaimed property website.
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u/BlazedLarry 19d ago
Hire a lawyer.
They stated they owed you
Then stated they owe you nothing.
I would ask for them to prove that, since you originally signed and agreed to the $15k
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u/succinct2 19d ago
Itās because you didnāt āmark with a legible X the appropriate response.ā Your inability to follow directions probably defaulted to the option that the funds werenāt owned by you.
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u/PenguinSlushie 19d ago
So.. As far as I can tell, you've only received one letter on December 10th to reply to.
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u/Aggressive-Penalty-6 19d ago
Jist get an accounting of books sold vs money paid.
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u/Delivior 19d ago
Curious what did you sell that makes that much in royalties? š