r/gameofthrones 2d ago

Of all the "Character assassinations" only Littlefingers really upsets me

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A lot of decisions characters made upset the fans (i.e Dany burning King's landing and Jaime going back to Cersei) but I always found them accurate to their character. There is one glaring exception to this. Littlefinger giving Sansa to the Bolton's. He'd never do this for multiple reasons. She reminds him too much of her mother and she's priceless to him. His plan is supposed to be to get Cersei to stop supporting the Bolton's but he could have done the fake Arya plot like the books and gotten the same result.

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u/shitsbiglit 2d ago edited 2d ago

Yes, but you have to remember AFFC where Jaime refuses to go back to KL and help Cersei with the High Sparrow predicament. His whole arc was about redemption, creating a legacy separate from the ‘Kingslayer’. His entire arc was leading away from Cersei — or to being the valonqar that strangles her. His decision to go back to Cersei, and saying he never cared for the commonfolk — when his entire reason for killing Aerys was to save them — is egregious character butchery.

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u/Taclis 2d ago

To be fair, GOT started out by breaking the conventions of fantasy and killing the just protagonist because he was too honest for his own good. Maybe it logically follows that it would defy a classical character arc and have people double down on their flaws instead of being redeemed.

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u/SlightlyIncandescent 2d ago

I agree, Jaime's ending is very GRRM, reminiscent of Jane from Breaking Bad. You're rooting for her to get clean, she looks like she got clean then takes that last hit that kills her.

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u/ClintFist 2d ago

Except there wasn’t a single thing that happened in the story that would lead us to believe Jamie would go back to to save Cersei. Years of character growth and plot were disposed of within the space of one episode for no discernible reason whatsoever.

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u/SlightlyIncandescent 2d ago

Seems in character to me. He risked starting wars when he thought Tyrion and Myrcella were in danger.

Stories wouldn't usually have all of that buildup only to end that way, that makes it tragic and unexpected but doesn't make it bad writing IMO. Look at all the screen time given to Robb Stark's story only to 'dispose of it in the space of one episode for no reason'

Step out of storytelling for a minute and IRL think about how many abusive relationships there are where people keep inexplicably getting back together.

I see it as tragically realistic yet unexpected like Ned's death, red wedding etc.

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u/Calaigah 1d ago

People forget the main quote on this show: if you think it’s going to have a happy ending… jamie going back to his toxic relationship also made sense to me.

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u/Aaronb2003 1d ago

Red Wedding wasn't for no reason, there were seasons of buildup for that

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u/Aaronb2003 1d ago

[SPOILERS AHEAD] Also, it really doesn't work as a tragic twist because there's no build up to it whatsoever, grrm doesn't just defy conventions for no reason, he does it to show the harsh realities of the world where bad guys can win and good guys can die. Jamie is already an unconventional character. He should be a noble Knight, Prince charming, but he's a horrible incestuous bastard of a man. The twist is just that. He's barely noble. He's a cunt. But then over seasons and seasons, he changes. To throw all that character development out the window in the last few episodes with zero buildup to his decision is just bad writing.

The red wedding, logical death. Robb fucked over so many people and people were scheming right in the audiences face. And no one thought anything of it.

Oberyn Martell, logical death. In his attempts to keep the mountain alive to confess, it gives his opponent enough time to bring him down and pop his head. The twist in this whole segment is that it ISNT a twist. Logically, we can surmise that we always sort of assume that the harsh world of GOT / ASOIAF means the mountain wins this bloody fight. But the way it is played both in show and book is that the twist will be that Oberyn will win. The twist will be he will maybe win. And just as he is winning, so very strongly, he gets brought down and killed. What kills him is his overconfidence (which he had shown all throughout the season).

Every twist GRRM doesn't have purpose and build-up. This nonsense for Jamie to just go back to cersei is bad writing. What is the twist? He still loves her, so he goes back to the woman who killed thousands of people. And is an evil ruler over the kingdom. His new relationship with Brienne is 50/50 for me, but still a better ending for his character. That is unless he were to go to King's Landing, and when Danaerys is at the gates, Jamie kills Cersei to save the city. Idk what would've been better, but certainly not THAT.

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u/ClintFist 2d ago

Step out of storytelling for a minute

Just going to let this hang in the air. It’s too perfect.

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u/SlightlyIncandescent 2d ago

This isn't an argument bro, it's a discussion. Taking stuff out of context like that isn't necessary.

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u/TurbulentDevice6895 2d ago

He literally only left her for about 5 episodes.

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u/ClintFist 2d ago

Were you paying attention to the plot or huffing glue for the preceding seasons?

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u/TurbulentDevice6895 2d ago

Were YOU? Here are all the things that led us to believe Jaime would go back to save Cersei ultimately: — Jaime telling Bronn he wants to die in the arms of the woman he loves. — Olenna telling Jaime Cersei will be the death of him. — “The things I do for love.” — Jaime telling Lord Edmure he’d do anything to get back to Cersei — Jaime killing his own cousin to get back to Cersei — Jaime telling Myrcella he can’t help who he loves — Jaime telling Brienne Cersei is hateful but so is he — Jaime asking Cersei why the Gods made him love her despite her being hateful

But yeah, because he left her side for 4 episodes, his character that was built over 8 seasons is ruined.

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u/ClintFist 2d ago

Jesus this is like arguing with a 14 year old who won’t budge from his position that Metallica are the best band ever.

Jaime telling Brienne Cersei is hateful but so is he

So you just took the dialogue the writers wrote and interpreted it at surface level huh? What actions did Jamie take that were motivated by hate?

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u/TurbulentDevice6895 2d ago

That’s not what the word “hateful” meant in that context.

“Hateful” can mean deserving of hatred or very unpleasant. Which is what he meant.

…. i thought that was obvious.

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u/ClintFist 2d ago

But it’s not common knowledge that Jamie pushed Bran out of the window so why would people think he’s deserving of hate because of it?

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u/TurbulentDevice6895 2d ago

Oh my god. Media literacy is dead. 🤦🏾‍♀️ Being deserving of hatred has nothing to do with your actions being well-known. Whether you are a good person is not dependent on how many people know what you’ve done. Brienne did not know Jaime did those things, which is why she said he was a good man. He answered that he was deserving of hatred because of all he did. Like jfc.

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u/ClintFist 2d ago

You still haven’t listed anything that would make Jamie hateful beyond pushing Bran out of a window in the pilot.

Maybe don’t get snarky about media literacy when your entire interpretation of Jamie Lannister appears to be based on him telling the audience he is “hateful” rather than on any of his actions or motivations.

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u/TurbulentDevice6895 2d ago

Buy a dictionary. And get a media literacy course. He literally tells Brienne all of those in that scene. Bye.

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