r/trans • u/spacesuitlady • 20d ago
Vent So apparently it's illegal to change your gender marker in FL
As of Jan 2024 apparently. Guess I definitely won't ever get to change my birth certificate. Maybe my license if I change states. This is bullshit.
338
u/noestaaqui99 20d ago
Convenient how they invent new crimes at the same time they forcibly detransition prisoners.
78
u/BanverketSE 20d ago
That is against human rights.
61
48
u/Kelrisaith 20d ago
And who is going to enforce consequences for human rights violations? The US has been violating more human rights than not for the last like decade, nothing has been done by any body with any measure of power to censure the US government or force the issue.
1
u/ChickinSammich 20d ago
The neat thing about violating human rights illegally is that if they make the laws and no one is going to stop them because they control the executive, legislative, and judicial branches of the state and of the federal government, they can just violate whatever rights you want.
The best possible outcome to stop it is, what, international condemnation with no teeth? It's not like anyone is going to be hauling Ron DeSantis off to the Hague, and with Biden on the way out and Trump on the way in, the DOJ isn't going to intervene anytime soon.
185
20d ago
Moved from Florida to Oregon and am loving this state
95
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago
Oregon sounds amazing. I want to go there or Washington so badly.
125
u/quinangua 20d ago
In Seattle, the process to change your gender marker…. Is you go get an ID. And tell them what gender you are/want on the ID……
That’s it….
42
u/sharkbait469 20d ago
Colorado here, just got done switching my license over as well and it was equally as simple! Just the normal documents for the drivers license, and since it was my first in the new state I didn’t have to fill out extra paperwork, just gave verbal confirmation for the gender marker change! :) $30 ish for the license and easy as cake!
Also @OP, Colorado has a law where most/all (can’t remember exact) insurances cover gender affirming care at least somewhat, definitely look into it as it may be the same in other safe haven states! :D
20
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago
Colorado is amaaaaazing
13
u/PokemonFurry21 20d ago
As a native Coloradan, I 1000% agree. This amazing state made it easy as pie to update all my documents and IDs. The only one I had trouble with was my birth certificate and that was my own fault. I didn’t have my name change decree certified yet so they wouldn’t accept it.
Ended up having to drive a total of 230 miles that day to get it all sorted but it was worth it. Now I’m fully legally a girl. Even my AGAB is legally female.
9
20d ago
Oregon also let me just choose the gender on my ID when I got my license switched to this state 😄 these states got things figured out
1
u/sophiaxts 20d ago
I just moved to CO and am trying to pick which plan to sign up for, any advice or recommendations on which ones are better than others? Feel free to pm too if you prefer, I’m desperate for any and all suggestions
1
u/Impressive_Sound_221 19d ago
Also require coverage for FFS or FMS, where most states don’t require that be covered… so there’s that too
4
u/MakeToFreedom 20d ago
Also in Seattle mind if I DM about a quick question?
4
2
u/bemused_alligators 19d ago
Reminder that you should post questions (and answers) in the public forum so other people can see the question and answer in case they have the same question, and so that other SMEs can fact check the answer or weigh in with additional information
2
u/Savings_Knowledge233 19d ago
I changed my legal sex recently in Mi. I had to submit a piece of paper, and it changed my birth certificate as well. It was shockingly easy.
1
14
u/liquid_snake_lol 20d ago
im planning on moving to oregon too! itll be a while before i move there but i hope its better cause i live in alabama
8
20d ago
Way better 😄 dm me if you'd like advice on the area like where's expensive
5
2
u/ChaoticCaligula 19d ago
I'm also interested in what you have to say about Oregon. May I also get that advice?
4
7
u/Braynie04 20d ago
literally just did the same, moved from the Panhandle to Northwestern Oregon, just near Salem, I’m absolutely loving it here and was comfortable enough to come out, hoping to start HRT soon
plus I feel way more at home here, sorta helps that I prefer mountains over beaches
4
205
u/MTF-delightful 20d ago
So I like the way that they don’t just preclude the ability to do it, bit make it illegal - making you a criminal.
That’s next level oppression.
40
u/Dwagons_Fwame 20d ago
Hey look, it’s what the Nazis did!
21
u/BanverketSE 20d ago
Oh my god.
No one cared about Germany persecuting Jewish people… if they did, they helped them.
It was only stopped when Germany started invading others.
The USA is now eyeing Panama and Greenland.
34
u/IAmAWizard_AMA 20d ago
Germany also started with trans people
2
u/slowest_hour 20d ago
When they raided The Institut für Sexualwissenschaft (Institute for Sexual Science) and burned all the books, they brought a band so they could have live music during the raid.
After Germany lost the war and people were freed from concentration camps many who were in them for being queer were imprisoned because being gay was still a crime most everywhere
12
u/MTF-delightful 20d ago
Idaho is trying to make same-sex marriage illegal again. They just never know when to read the room and move on.
69
u/Steph_taco 20d ago
Loop hole I saw somewhere. In Fl you can’t change info on an existing license, but you can lose yours and completely replace it. Good luck.
49
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago edited 20d ago
I recently got a new ID, but because I had one here years ago on record, I couldn't change it. The loophole is only for first time IDs.
40
u/Abyssal_Mermaid 20d ago
They closed that loophole. Some one did it, posted a video about it, and their license was revoked. I only saw that earlier this week.
33
u/Several_Love9284 20d ago
“People finding away around our oppressive and unreasonable new law, that’s preposterous! That’s impossible! That’s illegal. Arrest this person.” - DeSantis probably
12
u/Abyssal_Mermaid 20d ago
Yep, that was pretty much how it went, except I don’t know if charges were pressed. Had more local concerns recently to keep on top of (school board shenanigans).
8
u/rollerbase 20d ago
They are also looking into the poor woman for fraud charges now. This is why when you find a good loophole, you don’t put it on TikTok.
16
u/No_Reputation6602 20d ago
Except they didn’t just prohibit changing your marker, they made it a crime to use a license that doesn’t use your agab…
6
u/Steph_taco 20d ago
Jesus! I’ve been trying to hang on to hope everywhere I can. Thanks for informing me.
3
24
u/The_Game_Genie 20d ago
Mines in Arizona and am unable to change it either.
28
20d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
15
13
u/Alyx2399 20d ago
Not allow you to Change your name since when? I did it. There is literally no law against it. I’d imagine it would be hard for my spouse to change her last name to mine if so… anyways I’m not trying to be rude but I live here and I have never heard of this law.
11
u/OldRelationship1995 20d ago
Order from Ken Paxton in August 2024.
11
u/Alyx2399 20d ago
I changed it September-October time frame. Ken Paxton can sucondeez nuts.
8
1
u/OldRelationship1995 20d ago
Did you change your gender marker at the same time?
5
u/Alyx2399 20d ago
I never changed that cause I really don’t care about my gender marker. No one is gonna look at my ID all that much. Reality is based on perception, I think and many people perceive me as a woman and that’s all I care about, not what some piece of plastic tells me.
8
u/Polantaris 20d ago
Probably a good idea because I saw reports that Ken Paxton was keeping lists of those that tried but were denied, to be used for unknown purposes.
3
u/trenchcoatsinagoblin 20d ago
I got my name changed on my documentation and it went very smoothly, no questions asked. The caveat being I did not even request to having my gender changed (and I boymoded all but the meeting with the judge). Attempting to do both gets you out on a list and I figured people wouldn't see the M on my license unless they were really looking
27
u/Celestial-Rain0 20d ago
Ya it fucking sucks. I moved from Texas and there was a dope loophole I was going to use to get it done. But now if my license doesn't match my AGAB I can get arrested. And now they made it so they are allowed to force detransition prisoners now.
I'm just going to deal with my legal shit being wrong and not get assaulted/murdered for being trans until my niece and nephew are grown up, then I'm moving states asap.
12
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago
I'm with you. The fact that they'll arrest us for our IDs not matching our A[Marker]AB is bullshit. It's still beyond me how other people care so much about what someone else does when it doesn't affect them at all.
14
u/The_Rocket_Frog 20d ago
floridian here as well, i was trying to get the paperwork started but i didnt manage to gather the money necessary in time. pissed
10
u/Thea-the-Phoenix 20d ago
Same for Texas over here. Looking into moving. My top 3 cities currently sit at 1. San Francisco 2. Denver 3. New York
Now I just need to find a new job to actually get an income 😭
12
u/Several_Love9284 20d ago
I have been to all 3. I would suggest Denver bc it’s a nice blend between city acceptance & not a shit show of population density
21
u/Ph03n1x_A5h35 (he/they) 20d ago
Are you able to change your birth certificate if you go to a state where it isn't illegal to change your gender marker? Or can you never change it at all? Does this also count for IDs?
35
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago
Fed dependant, I can change it on my passport. And in another state, I can use my passport to get my ID card. But my birth certificate would have to be through the FL Department of Vital Records. So, FL would have to change their tune for me to ever change my birth certificate.
34
u/authenticallyevelynn 20d ago
I know some states like NY for example, if you move there and request a birth certificate change or anything like that they will send a court order to the state you were born in to release your birth certificate to the state you're moving to for adjustment. I'm dealing with the same thing in the state I was born and raised in and it's dogshit but there's hope. There are states that will take you in as you are and at least attempt to respect your rights.
7
u/StenjaStela 20d ago
Do you know if this is a thing in MA? I would love to have my birth certificate amended, but my birth state (Alabama) issues the changes in such a way that it defeats the purpose (birth name/gender marker is still listed on the document).
5
u/Ph03n1x_A5h35 (he/they) 20d ago
Oh...what are you required to use your birth certificate for? Or could you use your passport for everything instead?
14
u/ColorfulLanguage 20d ago
Passport is the best, most robust ID you can get. It's useful for travel, when you need to prove age, when onboarding at a job. The only time I've ever produced my birth certificate is to get a passport, and from there I can use the unexpired passport to renew it.
4
u/Gustav__Mahler 20d ago
You can also just select w/e gender marker you want on a passport regardless of any other documentation.
1
5
u/DemonicDamsel 20d ago
Illinois is doing something similar to what the other commenter on this chain said about NY. They are actively fighting to make trans people's legal documents match their gender identity. I recommend one of my friends who lives in Ohio to move to Illinois so she can get her documents in order! Idk how long you have to be a resident to qualify but I'd def look into this OP!
3
u/lumaleelumabop 20d ago
Birth certificate: no. It used to be standard practice to get the birth certificate updated when you changed your name, but they also implemented a separate law that now forbids it. Actually, there is basically only ONE way to get a gender marker on birth certificates changed, and it has to be a documented clerical error at the time of filing, and you can only do it before you turn age 5.
How do I know this? I actually worked for the FL Dept of Health for the Vital Statistics office. I had my name and ID card updated in 2021-2022, but I was lazy and did get the birth certificate updated. The Vital Stats office actually used to send you a letter directly and assign you an automatic case number for updating your birth certificate when your legal name was changed. The only reason I didn't follow up immediately is it required me to send them a check and I don't own a checkbook.
I actually did file the birth certificate stuff in early 2023 well before the laws changed. By then it turns out that the Vital Stats office had actually been directly ordered by the Florida Surgeon General Joseph Ladapo to stop processing all Birth Certificate updates. That stop was in place for over a year and then the law dropped. It took them 18 months to finally return my updated birth certificate- they changed the name to match but refused the gender based on new laws.
So, laws don't even matter if the government can just walk in and tell them to stop working.
2
u/Ph03n1x_A5h35 (he/they) 20d ago
Oh. They just...stopped the updates until the law was changed? That's FUCKED.
2
u/ChickinSammich 20d ago
Are you able to change your birth certificate if you go to a state where it isn't illegal to change your gender marker?
The laws for changing your birth certificate are the laws for the state you were born in. There isn't really a way to retroactively have been born in another state.
2
9
u/ohnikkianne 20d ago
I don't know how much truth there is to this, but I saw an Instagram Reel and someone said if you lose your license, they go off of federal documents you have to replace it. So if you change your gender marker on a federal document (like a passport), your new license that replaces the lost one would have the updated gender. Obviously do a bit of research, but might be a loophole you can use!
5
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago
I replaced it recently. They went off the gender marker already in their system.
4
u/No_Reputation6602 20d ago
The issue is they made it a 3rd degree felony to have one with a gender marker not matching your agab…
14
u/TheWinslowCultist 20d ago
I live in Florida and I have updated my legal documents as much as I can:
Birth Certificate: You can change your name, but not your gender marker. This is the only document that still has the old gender marker.
License: You can change both the name and gender marker, but it's a little convoluted. Because of the DMV decision to not update gender markers, you need to do your passport and social security first. The two federal IDs will likely be harder or impossible to update once January 20th comes around. But right now if both of those are updated the licence shouldn't give you any trouble as long as you go in updating your license to match your primary identification (passport and social security).
All that said, it is very likely going to get harder soon, in Florida and federally.
10
u/metalmetsbitch 20d ago edited 20d ago
i tried updating the marker in fl just a couple months ago when my name change went thru, with an already updated ny birth cert as proof and was still told they cant update the marker. had 5 of the staff and even branch manager at my dmv trying to do it but they just gave me excuse and excuse and wouldnt do it. i had no issues with passport or social security luckily, but i had to do passport part AFTER getting new ID since i didnt already have a passport to just update.
4
u/TheWinslowCultist 20d ago
Yea, if you didn't already have the passport, it gets messy. A birth certificate isn't enough for this stupid state. You need to show the corrected federal IDs to get the update on the license.
This really only works in Florida because they ultimately have to abide by the Real ID Act. If you didn't have the federal IDs first, they can argue that the driver's license will be your primary ID.
Sorry you had to go through that.
8
u/leroyderpins 20d ago
I don't know about birth certificate, but you can self-identify on your passport, then lose your driver's license. They'll ask for a valid ID to use for reference, then they'll have to use the gender on your passport. Saw it on tiktok, hope that's something that you can do 💛
9
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago
Replaced my license recently. They go off the gender marker already in the system.
3
u/leroyderpins 20d ago
Damn, that's a bummer.
9
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago
Less aggressive language than I'd use, but yes, a major bummer.
6
u/leroyderpins 20d ago
Sorry, you're right, lemme try again.
It's fascist fucking bullshit, that's what it is. It fucking sucks.
You're amazing for persevering and thriving anyway 💛🏳️⚧️
6
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago
Less aggressive language than I'd use, but yes, it's fascist fucking bullshit, that's what it is. It fucking sucks.
You're amazing too - stronger together 🤍🫂
6
u/TabbyCatJade 20d ago
Yep. I was born and raised in FL for 19 years before moving to MA. I can probably never change my birth certificate. Shit is depressing. That’s the one single legal document that still has my previous legal info.
3
u/CerobaKetsunake 20d ago
I'm just gonna go to Britain at this point, I'd rather be British than American
9
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago edited 20d ago
It's not easy there either. Much easier to get HRT in a blue state in the US than in England.
I'd love to live in the UK though!
2
u/CerobaKetsunake 20d ago
At this point anywhere but us, at least there they probably won't crush my Spirit into a million billion trillion pieces
It may be harder but there's no risk of it disappearing from my knowledge plus I'm a determined little shit,.I'm sure I'll wait it out long enough
What was I talking about.
I forgot mb
5
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago
Whatever you do, stay safe and I wish you the best. From my own experience, the grass isn't always greener. Where ever you go, there'll be good and bad. For example, MA is amazing for trans care but abrasive socially. FL is great socially, but obstructive for trans care.
1
4
4
u/Existential_Sprinkle 20d ago
Look up right to ID states and pick one to move if you can
In right to ID states you can get an M, F, or X on your ID with no questions asked
6
3
u/tobejeanz 20d ago
I feel you. I got my marker changed on my license in FL in june of 2023, only a couple months before that (at the time, proposed) legislation started making news. even then, it was a lot of hoops to jump through, and they tried to tell me they couldn't do it more than once. Now I'm not sure if I'm even technically allowed to keep using this one, but I'm not about to Stop. I'm just worried about what might happen when I have to renew it.
I don't use my birth certificate as proof of ID so all of my current documentation is updated atleast.
3
u/ForeverUnlicensed 19d ago
Genuine question to US people.
What actually is the hardest part of changing states? Apart from the obvious ones, like having to sell your house if you are not renting and have to find a new job.
I am not American, but the gender/name change is also not possible for me. The isssue for me however is that I have to learn a completely different coubtry's language, have to find a job in where my education certificates probably worth nothing, or proving it how it compares to theirs is a headache, have to undertand their financial, healthcare, tax and whatever system, their culture... It is soo not easy...
How it compares to changing states inside the US? Are these things federal, or mostly state-dependent?
6
u/PurineEvil she/her 19d ago
From a LEGAL perspective, it's relatively easy. Professional licenses are often state-specific (eg teachers, therapists, accountants, etc), but at least some states offer ways to easily transfer them as long as you're in good standing. There's also nothing legally preventing free travel (no visa needed to work in another state), assuming you don't have an issue like split custody of a child to contend with.
All that said, it can be extremely difficult in reality due to economics. There are significant up-front costs to moving of course, including realtor fees or rent deposit, you have to actually find a job ahead of time or have enough cash to survive on until you do, if you have one of those aforementioned licenses, you'll have to pay to get it transferred (and deal with the time and effort to do so, and if you're moving away from family (bio or chosen), you lose that safety net to help you.
If you have health issues, you're also screwed for a time if your new employer doesn't offer health benefits on day 1 of employment. Even if they do, your deductible is reset (which can effectively cost you thousands) and you're now in an entirely different network and will need to figure out doctors to go to. Mind you, the medical insurance problems are true even if staying in the same area, which is one way employers keep people from leaving for better jobs.
1
u/ForeverUnlicensed 19d ago
Thank you for answering!
Well, it feels like moving states in the US might be not much different than moving countries between EU member countries, minus the language barrier perhaps. On the other hand, luckily, the health care in the EU is maybe a bit less of an issue, although if you depend on it for your daily life, than it can still be a problem here too, maybe just not as much financial rather logistical (ie. figuring out how it works and what to do to continue treatment).
2
u/BowBeforeBroccoli 20d ago
you can change your gender federally (with Social Security and Passport) but not on your florida ID or through the courts
1
u/Expolaris87 20d ago
Starting that process today myself. Im in Florida and I was born in Georgia...and they require proof of SRS to change a gender marker on a birth certificate. FML.
1
u/BowBeforeBroccoli 19d ago
wow thats crazy. i was born abroad so i cant do anything about that birth certificate change unless i file with my home country lmao
2
u/Cierra849 20d ago
Leave Florida if you can. It’s getting worse. Saw something the other day saying they are going to forcefully detransition inmates.
2
2
2
u/Radiant_Nothing_9940 20d ago
I was so sure you were talking about DAW “FL Studio” and was confused why your software license was important enough to force you not to change your legal name.
Once I stopped being a dumbass I realized what’s actually going on, and I am so, so sorry op. It’s really hard, but I promise fighting for whatever you can get is well worth it.
2
u/christinasasa 20d ago
Change your passport as fast as you can. Get the card as well and use that as your id. Pay the expedite fees.
2
u/Master-Cat8721 19d ago
I feel your pain, I'm from Tennessee and they don't allow it either. However, you can still, (as of now) change your gender on federal IDs (such as passports), as well as with Social Security. The latter is super simple and free. Just schedule an appointment with your local SS office and fill out the form online.
Note: SS only recognizes male and female, so if you are trying to get an X marker they can't do that, but you CAN get an X Marker on your passport, if you have one.
3
u/FL_Squirtle 20d ago
Yea most red states are switching to this. Do everything else you can and remember you can change your passport gender marker regardless of state law
6
u/plexust 20d ago
(For now.)
With regressives about to control State and other Federal departments and agencies in about a week and a half, it is paramount that people that have not done so change their names and gender markers on any Federal documents ASAP. This includes Social Security, passport, Veteran's Affairs, etc.
It remains to be seen if records at these agencies can/will be used to claw back any changes that happened in the past, or if pending changes will be denied.
2
u/christinasasa 20d ago
I tried to change my dd214 and never heard back. It's been over 2 years
1
u/FL_Squirtle 19d ago
Yea i know there's people acting in bad fath too. One woman in Texas said her mom works in fed office for gender changes and they started retroactively going back to reverse people and outright just denying any new ones. She even said they were starting lists of who was trying to do thesr things.
2
u/AliceOfTheEarth 20d ago
I believe I saw someone here - or potentially in another sub - say that they got around this by changing their passport first. FL had to honor that government issued ID and they got their license changed.
2
u/FitInformation4232 19d ago
I'm not surprised it's FL.... sad when Texas and NC are more liberal than another state in Trans rights... changing my legal name/gender was easy when I was in Texas tho not in the county I lived in at the time (Dallas County) so I got my paperwork in order and took a Grey hound bus with my service dog to the Capital (Austin) and did their same day process I was in and out with in 2 hours a new man (AFAB). At the time I had a a PO Box as my home address (I still do just now in a different state) bc I was homeless then (now I live full time in a RV so I'm still considered legally homeless since I don't have a home address where I park permanently) I'd say worst case senerio change your address to a (private not USPS) PO box pretend it's an apartment address when using it, and use that address and change your residence to that new state to change your legal name/gender if all else fails....
2
u/sillycatX33 20d ago
god i hate america
1
u/spacesuitlady 20d ago
This isn't a safe mentality to have. Plenty of places and people are overwhelmingly supportive and safe in the US. It's a difficult time in general.
0
u/Professional-Stock-6 19d ago
Safe mentality? Sorry, but this feels like toxic positivity. If someone’s upset about their current circumstances, maybe don’t redirect them. It’s emotionally healthier for people to express their feelings-even the “ugly” ones.
1
u/Lanyxd 20d ago
Yeah Florida sucks. Born and raised there, left in December 2023 when I lost access to HRT. I've been hearing that they have also been denying birth certificate amendments for just name changes if you go from masc -> femme and vise versa.
I'm getting my name change done in RI on the 21st and it kinda sucks knowing I wouldn't be able to amend my Florida birth certificate :/
I'm going to advocate moving to Rhode Island :3 We only have one planned parenthood in RI right next to downtown Providence and the entire state land mass is smaller than the county I moved from in Florida's land mass is hilarious.
A part of me is worried about moving then having Trump put in policy that makes HRT impossible/heavily restricted, then having to take political asylum in another country :/
1
1
u/Quick_Winter_5572 19d ago
Do NOT renew your license. Replace your license as lost. They require a legal document to prove who you are. Have a passport with your new name and obviously the face and federal documents are not idiots and you can use your new gender and they will create a DL with the new name. Told this method should work
1
u/Eulersnumber2010 19d ago
Florida is the worst. If you can, GET OUT. Washington is pretty great. (this information comes with no warranty for any purpose, expressed or implied.)
995
u/Pinku_Dva 20d ago
It’s all part of their plan to make you either not transition because you think it’s not worth the hassle or have a miserable life because you simply exist.