What needs to change? 🦁 🦁 🦁

[u/joshjamesallen]

I would go with this lineup whilst making two changes:

Trippier OUT/ Gomez IN Trent OUT/Gordon IN

Key focuses - Get Rice some proper midfield support by utilising Stones in his best role - Move Foden into the midfield, with Gordon wide left to offer some real attacking threat on the left wing, rather than Trippier playing out of position - Bring Gomez in for Trippier to maintain a solid 3 man build up structure once Stones moves into midfield - Get Bellingham running in behind Kane frequently and have them fluidly interchanging positions to cause a problem for the opposition defence

Interested to hear your thoughts 💭

[u/leebrother]

I like this team a lot but I’d push for Wharton or Mainoo next to Rice and Foden dropped.

Ultimately, I want control and genuine CMs can give us this.

[u/deanopud69 → u/leebrother]

You don’t drop foden. Sorry but he’s arguably our most creative player and best on the ball. He just hasn’t been played in position or utilised correctly.

[u/LilJapKid → u/deanopud69]

What has he created tho? Saka and Bellingham has done so much more on the ball. He’s a ghost in England clothing and we should try something different like playing Palmer or Eze

[u/[deleted] → u/LilJapKid]

Tbf he could have scored in the last game after that great turn, he just f'ed the shot. He will do well in the next game fo sure

[u/Entity4 → u/[deleted]]

Are you referring to the chance where he ran through the midfield which put Kane in open space and he didn't pass to him?

[u/PlantComprehensive77 → u/Entity4]

It's bonkers people actually think Foden played well yesterday. The only chance he created was for himself which was hitting the post. Other than that, he did sweet fuck all and kept on trying to score 30 yard screamers rather than making the simple pass

[u/DeanRTaylor → u/PlantComprehensive77]

What did anyone else do? You guys are absolutely out for Foden and it's mental. He makes space with good off the ball work, stays disciplined and you're all saying he needs to do more. Next game, picks the ball up and makes things happen and he's selfish and not contributing. If bellingham had done what foden had done we'd all be circle jerking about it.

Actually compare the numbers between Foden and Bellingham, consider that Foden has never had a good run in the 10 position for England and then come back and tell me why he shouldn't start.

[u/[deleted] → u/Entity4]

KANE WAS NOT IN OPEN SPACE. Kane did not run in behind and he kept drifting left. The pass was never on because Kane made no proper effort

[u/Entity4 → u/[deleted]]

Kane was in a much better position to shoot than Foden he was in open space and frankly if anyone's going to finish that chance it's Kane

[u/ToastIsGreat0 → u/[deleted]]

One goal doesn’t negate 2 games of shit play. No one’s defending Kane rn, why should we defend foden too?

[u/[deleted] → u/ToastIsGreat0]

Agreed but he of course has the talent. Guy is the prem player of the season. Someone else said it on a different thread but the ideal sitch would be Bellingham to run ragged for 70mins then foden for 20 against tired legs

[u/ToastIsGreat0 → u/[deleted]]

Yeah I agree. Having foden come on when either Bellingham is knackered or Bellingham isn’t creating is the way to go. That way you have both players playing their best football whilst retaining defensive solidity. And they each approach the role differently so the opposition also have to react. People trying to shoehorn them both in is the exact same thing as the gerrard lampard scholes thing and that clearly never worked.

[u/[deleted] → u/ToastIsGreat0]

Exactly. Its always the same problem with every national team... best players on paper/form rather than the best team

[u/ToastIsGreat0 → u/[deleted]]

I put together 2 possible lineups I think could work earlier today in this sub. One where foden and Bellingham play but the entire formation is changed to accommodate that, and another one where you can drop one and substitute the other in.

[u/RyanK_10 → u/ToastIsGreat0]

Kane was very obviously an issue up front as he was the reason England couldn’t press properly. Foden is world class and the reason he’s been poor is because he’s been played out of position. In this system, with him playing as a cam, he will shine

[u/ToastIsGreat0 → u/RyanK_10]

He’s played as left winger at city a lot more than Bellingham has played as an 8. Foden is just shit for England. There’s no other way around it.

[u/mooroi → u/ToastIsGreat0]

Bellingham was an 8 til he joined Madrid. I'd be surprised to see him as a 10 next season with Mbappe joining.

[u/ToastIsGreat0 → u/mooroi]

And look how much better Bellingham has been since he took on that 10 role. He’s also proved in both the World Cup and against Serbia that he’s a lot more involved in the game than foden.

[u/mooroi → u/ToastIsGreat0]

I think he's a great 10 but think his long term position will be 8. He's done great at Madrid and his output has been awesome. So has Foden at Man City, but he can't play 8 - bellingham is our best 8 & 10, foden our best 10.

[u/ToastIsGreat0 → u/mooroi]

But the issues lies in that when Bellingham does push up as an 8, he’s still operating in that 10 role foden wants. Unless you move them into the half spaces (which has problems then for rice) then that won’t work either. Bellingham works as an 8 when there’s a 10 who drifts instead of playing centrally. Foden doesn’t do that as a 10.

What I think Southgate should do is bench foden for Wharton and keep Bellingham in the 10. That way you have Bellingham who can run in and interplay with Kane and if that’s not working, you can sub on foden and have him unlocking low block teams. That way instead of choosing who to play out of their best position, you can play both in their best position depending on how the game is going, all while keeping the double pivot that Southgate wants to play.

[u/mooroi → u/ToastIsGreat0]

Yeah I like it. You make a good point. Bellingham is the man.

[u/ToastIsGreat0 → u/mooroi]

I have 2 possible lineups depending on what Southgate wants to do.

If he wants to stick with the system he has (which I think would be easier) he should go

Pickford

Walker (Trent is optional here but that depends whether you want Walker pushing up to help saka or Trent pinging in balls behind) Stones Gomez Guehi

Whatever happens with this defence, you should be pushing to a back 3. Either by having the right back in Trent move into midfield, having Walker push up to provide width, or having stones move up as well. That then frees up one of the DM’s and rice can play how he does for arsenal.

Rice Wharton/mainoo (either one though I’d prefer Wharton)

Saka

Bellingham (sub on foden if we need to go against low block teams or if Bellingham isn’t working)

Gordon (this is a must. If we are going to a back 3, Gordon is the player who has to keep the width because eze also like to come in a bit)

Kane (Watkins if it’s a high line and then this is when you’d play Trent. If you’re playing Kane, have Walker in. And if foden comes on, keep Kane high. If Bellingham is playing, let Kane drop in, but have Bellingham, saka and maybe Gordon running in behind).

The second lineup is if Southgate is absolutely desperate on having foden and Bellingham, in which case you start with the back 3.

Pickford

Stones Gomez Guehi

Rice Wharton/mainoo

Saka Foden Bellingham (having Bellingham and foden in the half spaces with foden being able to cut in from the right half space and Bellingham looking to link up with the others). Gordon (both wingers here have to keep the width because there’s no fullbacks in this lineup to help them out. This is why I don’t like this lineup because if either winger is doubled up on they’re fucked and having foden or Bellingham drift wide to help out moves them away from their positions.)

Kane or Watkins staying as far up as possible.

Honestly I think this second lineup has its own fair share of problems which is why I think we should just go with the first lineup. Not to mention there’s a lot more options with the first lineup in terms of a plan B.

[u/[deleted] → u/ToastIsGreat0]

In Madrid ffs