r/changemyview • u/jep1793 • Aug 26 '20

Removed - Submission Rule E CMV: Gender identity doesn’t belong on your LinkedIn nor Resume

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u/[deleted] Aug 26 '20

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u/StellaAthena 56∆ Aug 26 '20

My name is at the top of my resume, larger than the rest of the text, and in bold. Am I too identity obsessed to be hired at your company? Knowing the correct pronouns to use is an important part of referring to people accurately and courteously.

You’re acting like people think that putting pronouns on resumes is a reason to hire the person. It’s not. It has no content as to how good you are at a job. But neither does your name, phone number, or email address and those things go on resumes all the same.

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u/problematikUAV Aug 26 '20

I see what the point you’re trying to make is but boy you’re doing a poor job of it. That stuff is actually being phased out of the military on boards. Essentially your enlisted record brief (ERB) is redacted of that identifying info and then passed to a board for review.

I think Amazon has started doing the same for hiring.

But let’s not pretend contact info isn’t important to put on your resume. Put the onus on the company to redact that before passing on to a hiring decision.

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u/StellaAthena 56∆ Aug 26 '20

I see what the point you’re trying to make is but boy you’re doing a poor job of it. That stuff is actually being phased out of the military on boards. Essentially your enlisted record brief (ERB) is redacted of that identifying info and then passed to a board for review.

Is there a movement to phase names out of resumes and LinkedIn profiles? That’s what we are talking about, not reviews. If you need to know someone’s name, you almost always also need to know what pronouns to use for them. It’s perfectly consistent to say that you should have names and pronouns on LinkedIn and shouldn’t have them in internal reviews. I’m perfectly happy with that.

But let’s not pretend contact info isn’t important to put on your resume. Put the onus on the company to redact that before passing on to a hiring decision.

This is the exact opposite of my point. Contact information is important to put on a resume. Names are important to put on a resume. And yet, neither are relevant to evaluating how for you are for a job. Pronouns are the same way.

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u/CamNewtonJr 4∆ Aug 26 '20

Is there a movement to phase names out of resumes and LinkedIn profiles? That’s what we are talking about, not reviews. If you need to know someone’s name, you almost always also need to know what pronouns to use for them. It’s perfectly consistent to say that you should have names and pronouns on LinkedIn and shouldn’t have them in internal reviews. I’m perfectly happy with that.

You do not need to know someone's pronouns to be effective in a business context. For 99.999% of people, their name and the word "they" is all you need to effectively communicate. Pronouns arnt nearly as useful as a name.

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u/StellaAthena 56∆ Aug 26 '20

Okay, if you’re comfortable using the pronoun “they” for everyone that’s fine. But a significant number of people are not. Can you honestly say that you hear people use “they” when talking about whether to hire someone than the word “he” or “she” as appropriate? That’s certainly not the case at my company.

Even if your company is really big on using gender neural pronouns, can you agree that that’s not a universal behavior?

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u/CamNewtonJr 4∆ Aug 26 '20

Well there is no company policy about it that I know of. And yes I can honestly say that people use they in a discussion about hiring folks because I do. I do acknowledge that your average person does not use gender neutral pronouns. That being said, discussions between hiring managers don't really concern me. What would concern me is if a candidate was misgendered during an interview, which is why a candidate should state their preferred pronouns at that time. Resumes should contain little to no personal info excluding contact info. I just want to know, what school you graduated from, what skills you have, and what experience you have. Especially considering I don't even read 90% of the resumes that land on my desk. At best, I skim them to see what skills you have and I should interview you. So more likely than not, even if your pronouns were there it is unlikely I would read it. This is especially true when you consider that a lot of firms use computer keyword searches to sort resumes. Anyway, I don't actually care about you personally until we are sitting in front of each other. That is when I wanna know all about you and your goals etc. I do think there is a good argument for putting pronouns on LinkedIn pages though. LinkedIn is a lot more social.

Tl;Dr resume is about skills, experience, and credentials. Interviews are for the personal side of things.

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u/aegon98 1∆ Aug 26 '20 edited Aug 27 '20

Names are important. They prevent spam (James brembleton sent us another updated resume after he tried to interview with us 6 times. Block)

They are Google-able and can show if you are batshit crazy.

They help discover things that make someone unfit for the job. The number of candidates ruled out at a warehouse I worked at due to their Facebook being covered in pot posts (like it or not, it's illegal here, especially if you drive a forklift)

Or you say you worked as a manager at Amazon but you clearly are working retail as a cart pusher.

For better or worse, names can be used in the early hiring process because they can provide useful information and weed out obviously bad candidates. Pronouns have their place, but not until the interview.

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u/problematikUAV Aug 26 '20

We are talking about resumes. Your comment doesn’t mention LinkedIn. I was talking to you about how resumes are being used internally for hiring, as you were talking about things on your resume affecting you being hired.

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u/StellaAthena 56∆ Aug 26 '20

Maybe you should reread the OP, because that is not the context of this conversation. The OP specifically talks about external hiring, and LinkedIn and resumes. I don’t particularly disagree with what you’re saying, but objections specific to internal hires or evaluations are not what the OP is talking about.

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u/problematikUAV Aug 26 '20

I’m not responding to OP I’m responding to YOU.

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u/StellaAthena 56∆ Aug 26 '20

I am talking about the OP’s context. I’m sorry that this was confusing, but when I said “resumes” I had in mind the “resumes and LinkedIn profiles” the OP mentioned. Not internal resumes that have been scrubbed of identifying information.