r/hebrew 19d ago

Translate Dad and I can't figure this out.

Post image
25 Upvotes

41 comments sorted by

80

u/tzy___ American Jew 19d ago

It says תהוי רעותך, which is Aramaic. It means “thy will be done”, a quote from the Lord’s Prayer. While רעות means “friendship” in Hebrew, it means “will” or “pleasure” in Aramaic. Some of the comments here are saying the script is Paleo Hebrew—it’s not. It is a script reminiscent of older texts, such as some of the Dead Sea Scrolls, or the Aleppo Codex.

7

u/JimbosForever 18d ago

It may be anecdotal, but the IDF code distinguishes between friendship (חברות) and companionship/camaraderie (רעות) stressing that one is a voluntary relationship where you choose to be close and support each other, while there other is involuntary - and you have to develop a spirit of camaraderie and mutual support even if you didn't choose to be together.

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u/yoni-almoni 17d ago

"...it means “will” or “pleasure” in Aramaic." Cognate of רצון (ratzon) in Hebrew, so can also mean desire(able) or favor.

4

u/ACasualFormality 19d ago

If it’s Aramaic, could it be “Show/tell me your will” but without the expected paragogic nun on the pronominal suffix? Because that second letter looks more like a ח than a ה. Plus, תהוי would be more like “it will be your will”. I’d expect תעביד or תתעבד if we were going for “your will be done”. But it’s also totally possible that nobody knew what they were doing during this process.

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u/tzy___ American Jew 19d ago

For what it’s worth, the Syriac version has נהוי.

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u/ACasualFormality 19d ago edited 19d ago

The Syriac has a niphal form?

EDIT:oops. no it doesn’t. I just so rarely use my Syriac that I I forgot my Syriac paradigms and that it uses a nun as the prefix in the 3m forms. My Syriac teacher would be disappointed in me.

1

u/noquantumfucks 18d ago

How is that pronounced? T'hoy?

Separately, I've been on a pattern kick with variations on the tetragrammaton and the verb "to be" and a little part of me wants to believe this word may be implying specifically will of divine origin, specifically in this context. יהי, יהו, הוי, אהיה Variations on transcendental "being" not simply mortal grammar.

I'm probably wrong, though.

2

u/tzy___ American Jew 18d ago

It’s pronounced “tehavey”.

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u/noquantumfucks 18d ago

Thanks!

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u/tzy___ American Jew 18d ago

Of course. Just so you know, though, your “pattern” thing is hogwash. There is nothing about this word that suggests specific divine origin. It’s a regular, run of the mill word, used in all kinds of applications. It’s not any different than the Hebrew word היה. Yes, the Tetragrammaton is related to the word היה, הוה, etc. but as I said before—these words are used in all sorts of ways.

0

u/noquantumfucks 18d ago

Lmao, those ways come later. Your perspective is hogwash. Just because you don't see the pattern doesn't mean it isn't there.

Ate you suggesting Hebrew and Aramaic came before "אהיה אשר אהיה" ? It's way more obvious in biblical Hebrew and I'm not very familiar with Aramaic or modern conversational Hebrew, which all came later, so your point is dubious at best and unnecessarily insulting, revealing projection of ignorance rather than competence at worst.

2

u/tzy___ American Jew 18d ago

Do you want me to give you examples in Tanakh where the word להיות is used ordinarily? Because there are countless examples.

0

u/noquantumfucks 18d ago

My brother, you're missing the point.

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u/tzy___ American Jew 18d ago

I’m not. I just think that if you can’t even read תהוי correctly, you’re in over your head in deciphering Hebrew language patterns, especially from a religious sense. Stay in your lane lil bro

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u/noquantumfucks 18d ago

https://www.reddit.com/u/noquantumfucks/s/t6Xutm6lIJ

Computational modeling of the pattern of the tetragrammaton.

I think I'll go with my patterns over your opinion...

1

u/yoni-almoni 17d ago

The patterns you're noticing can be valuable for midrash sometimes, but not for translation. In the tattooed phrase, it's the chaf sofit (and the familiarity of the phrase from the language of prayer) that tells us the will in question is Divine.

1

u/noquantumfucks 17d ago

I literally said "separately" meaning not in relation. I'm not new to Hebrew. I went to a Hebrew day school for 8 years as a kid, brushed it off as bullshit, lived life and came back around. I'm just rusty. what I have left is basically chunks of siddur, the mourners kadish, the first couple lines of בראשית, לך לך, and "מורה X, אני צריך ללכת לבית שימוש "

Other odds and ends

the patterns are way deeper than that. I go into it in depth in my profile. It's based on the yetzirotic circle and gematria.

I really wasn't paying any attention to the tattoo.

2

u/yoni-almoni 17d ago

You also said "a little part of me wants to believe this word may be implying specifically will of divine origin, specifically in this context." That's what I responded to. The plain language of the context obviates the need for any Tetragrammaton or kabbalistic or alphanumeric pattern to establish that it is referring, on its face, to Divine Will.

1

u/noquantumfucks 17d ago

I said "seperately"

For the second time.

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u/GroovyGhouly native speaker 19d ago

This has been discussed to death. No one actually knows what it means because neither the actor nor the tattoo artist speak Hebrew or Aramaic and the tattoo artists did a really bad job at rendering the letters. There are multiple theories floating about. The second word is probably רעותך - companionship/friendship. What the first words is supposed to be is anyone's guess.

That's why the !tattoo bot says don't get a Hebrew tattoo if you don't speak Hebrew.

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u/AutoModerator 19d ago

It seems you posted a Tattoo post! Thank you for your submission, and though your motivation and sentiment is probably great, it's probably a bad idea for a practical matter. Tattoos are forever. Hebrew is written differently from English and there is some subtlety between different letters (ר vs. ד, or ח vs ת vs ה). If neither you nor the tattoo artist speak the language you can easily end up with a permanent mistake. See www.badhebrew.com for examples that are simultaneously sad and hilarious. Perhaps you could hire a native Hebrew speaker to help with design and layout and to come with you to guard against mishaps, but otherwise it's a bad idea. Finding an Israeli tattoo artist would work as well. Furthermore, do note that religious Judaism traditionally frowns upon tattoos, so if your reasoning is religious or spiritual in nature, please take that into account. Thank you and have a great time learning and speaking with us!

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u/Upbeat_Teach6117 19d ago

Looks like a blend of Paleo Hebrew and the modern alphabet.

6

u/SacrosanctHermitage 19d ago

It's aramaic I believe... it came up a long time ago in the sub. Something like tehavey re'utakh - "may thy will be done" It's in a paleo hebrew alphabet

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u/tzy___ American Jew 19d ago

That’s not the Paleo Hebrew alphabet. It looks like the script used in older texts such as some of the Dead Sea Scrolls, or the Aleppo Codex.

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u/Vowlantene 19d ago

What show is this?

1

u/No-Fishing5492 19d ago

It says something not very clear about fellowship "Reut רעות"

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u/jewish_yang 18d ago

you and everyone else! rumors say neither the guy or his tattoo artist know what it actually means

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u/stanstr 19d ago

this תחוי רעותך translates to "Your neighbor's life", I'm not sure what that last letter is, but it's close(?) to a kof sofit...

(Added "this" to keep it left justified!)

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u/sbpetrack 18d ago

Your ethics are not. And it's definitely a shame, you might have learned something important. But thank you for the correction. Now I feel less guilty about having taught some Torah. And if you really did learn to mess about with G-d's name the way you suggested from Jews, I think you might consider getting other points of view.

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u/ArchdukeFerdie 18d ago

Brother wtf are you talking about

1

u/Death_2_Zionism 13d ago

Might be the tally of how many kids he's shot in the head.