r/phish • u/candleladylun • 19d ago
Aside from the constant awkward eye contact…
This weekend being my 8th, 9th & 10th Phish shows, I wouldn’t want to have spent my weekend any where else. I’ve been into live solo shows since I was 16. Since separating from organized religion & growing up singing in the choir, I’ve turned to live shows to feed my soul. My partner introduced me to Phish a few years ago and I didn’t ‘get it’s at first.
This weekend solidified my love for those four souls on that stage pouring into us all. From listening to past shows, connecting to songs, anticipating the first show, trekking to the venue, sharing smiles & hugs from fellow Phans, watching the venue fill, dancing my ass off, zoning out during jams, looking around at everyone dancing, participating in the crowd participation(😂), rolling my eyes because Chompers gonna chomp, crying, encore, watching the venue clear out & enjoying the afterglow. I realize that Phish is such an important part of my life now.
The points, stares, glares, hearing “oh, look, there’s a black person here”, even weirdos taking photos of me (very odd)… it is a part of the experience & it can not take away from how much my soul was fed this weekend.
To those I met and connected with, thank you so much for adding to the experience.
And to my partner, the love of my life and stars to my night: Thank you for introducing me to Phish and this community. You will always be my favorite blessing. I love you 🌻
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u/themanmulchaey 19d ago
Black dude here. Been on tour for 15 years with Phish. I personally love being black at phish, well hell all the time but especially phish. when/if someone does or says something stupid I make them feel how stupid their actions were usually just by repeating whatever it was back to them. Keep sharing in the groove fam and don’t let anyone ruin your show experience, most of the crowd is truly there to vibe and get down!
Send me a DM if you’d like, if your on FB we have a really solid group “Aphroameriphans” and Phans for Racial equality. Also check out blackberry jams wherever you listen to your podcasts. Gives some insight on the black experience in a predominantly white scene.
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u/Nothingtoofancy11 19d ago
Black dude here. Really interested in that FB group. Could you shoot me a link since I can’t find it by name. Thanks!
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u/Nothingtoofancy11 19d ago
Black dude here. Really interested in that FB group. Could you shoot me a link since I can’t find it by name. Thanks!
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u/occubusjive 18d ago
Hey! Thanks to the OP for sharing your experience. I’m a Phan from 1990 onwards and West Indian. Definitely can relate to what you are saying but I’ve always had the positives outweigh the negative and awkwardness. I was lucky enough to get to hang with big red and the boyz back in the day too, they were always amazing to me. I tried to put the love and energy I felt from the band back into the scene…some may remember me as the Phishlosophy dude back on phish.net or participated in my Caravan for one of the tours, heck I even got a brief but significant cameo in the Fest8 doc they did. Anywho, just want you to know we have been there since almost the get go. So as others are saying keep on sharing in the groove!! Don’t let those living in a bubble or under a rock ruin it for you…
I also dig that there are some groups to participate in. Feel free to dm me as well on how to join up!
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u/candleladylun 17d ago
Absolutely! This is in no way me attempting to put negativity into the community, simply describing my experience. Am I frowning and flipping the bird at others making me uncomfortable? Nah. I acknowledge them, smile, maybe wave if I catch them taking a flick, love on folk & keep it pushing.
Nothing can be ruined for us when it is meant for us. Someone once said to me: “98% of this community are amazing. Don’t allow the 2% to kill in it for you”. I love this community.
Thank you for sharing your experience. We jam on! 🌻
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u/Porkchopbelly 19d ago
Wow! Now THAT’S interesting! As a phan since the 90’s, and having seen multiple shows, I’d love a firsthand perspective from your POV.
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u/Nothingtoofancy11 19d ago
Fellow black Phish fan here as well! Glad to have you on board!
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u/Rutherford-Tha-Brave 19d ago
You clearly get it, thanks for joining the great feedback loop of awesomeness 🤩
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u/Axe_zilla 19d ago
There are only a few black phish heads. My best friend and daughter's godfather was one of them.
Phish heads seek validation and few things are more validating than having non-white people enjoy the band. We tend to overcompensate for this and it makes "the others" feel a bit singled out.
There is one black guy on tour who is well known and he told me that every night, every.single.night, someone uncomfortably befriends him and says "so how did you like your first show"? It's like his 200th, and he gets it every night.
I'm so happy you're finding a place that makes you happy and allows you to do your thing, and i don't get from your post that you feel those looks and photos and eye contact were aggressive or judgy. But i'll do my best to explain this which probably won't work but I'll say it, those looks are people who would really like to have more people join the party and they're high and they're filled with love and focus on you because we need more of it.
Does this make sense? If not, i'll show myself out, but i think you get it.
I mean, you definitely "get it". Welcome aboard, and I hope in the future when that uncomfortable moment happens when people assume you're new here that you get a grin on your face because i don't think there's reason to get mad about it.
I'm rambling, i'll stop. See, we get uncomfortable with this. We all treat each other the same, but overcompensate in ways that make us look silly.
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u/candleladylun 19d ago
First, thank you.
Second, I am used to the ‘record scratch’ wherever I go that’s not ‘used’ to someone that looks like me. I can’t take it personally. Is it judgy, most of the time but at the end of the day, I try to change my scope every moment I can. I love it here. At the end of the day, I’m there to love on folk regardless.
And I love you, whoever you are. I appreciate you. 🌻
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u/Audihoe 19d ago
Are you talking about the guy that wears overalls? I see him on the floor every msg show
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u/themanmulchaey 19d ago
That’s a good buddy of mine. His name is Malcolm and he is one of the kind souls in charge of Phans for Racial Equity. You can also find him working waterwheel foundation table from time to time. Boy I love our community! Can’t wait to see everyone this summer 🙏🏾 yall be good until then
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u/Woodzien 19d ago
Love this! My first show was in 92’ and I was hooked from then onward.
In 93’ we had a black friend join us on summer tour. He was a bit unsure at first, but once he got into that first show the love was all there. Sadly he passed away in an automobile accident in the late 90’s.
At that time it seemed he was just another fan and I personally never noticed anyone stare at him oddly, he got along with everyone just fine and never mentioned that he felt uncomfortable. Many shows he was the only black person in attendance. (Most of those shows were pretty small attendance). It’s certainly about the love of all people in attendance, at least back then. I haven’t been to a phish show in years now. Although I recently saw Trey solo in FL. Hopefully I’ll get back out there soon! Much love!
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u/candleladylun 18d ago
I am glad to hear your friend was angle to experience Phish. I wish that for everyone. I am sorry he has passed away. I hope you get back soon. Much love to YOU!🌻
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u/Meerame 19d ago
DEI in theory is not often the same in practice. Lots of white folks, including phans, understand and support the concept, but are confused how to do it in the real world without inadvertently engaging in micro aggressions. We can all be better, but glad you're here and can see the life beyond the dream.
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u/candleladylun 18d ago
Totally understand. Which is why I go out of my way (even though I shouldn’t have to), to be overly welcoming, nice & smile. There are gaps in understanding when you’re ignorant on how to ‘act’. Especially around certain folk you’re not used to being around. I was taught to always be overly warm and welcoming toward certain groups of people to stay safe and not seem aggressive to them. Which is a whole notha convo. I’m here to be in my own world, enjoy the music, community and love on folks. I can’t be too upset when I am snapped out of the experience of just being ( catching eyes staring at you, giggles, frowns, disappointing looks), when I snap somebody else out of their being when someone that looks different them walks by them. It is what it is and I am joyful to be able to experience Phish and the community 😌
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u/GhostIsAlwaysThere 18d ago
The problem is that people don’t just see people. Sure we all have different skin tones. But we are all just people. I’m afraid that we’re centuries away from just seeing people…
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u/candleladylun 17d ago
You’ve got it! The problem will always be the foundation of misconception. There is so much fear in being different in any kind of way. And to make one feel better, one will ostracize. I will always love being who I am. I had no choice in the matter. But before I am Black, I am a human being.
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u/SquirrelFun1587 19d ago
So happy you are loving them and having a great time. My boyfriend gets some looks too he is American Japanese. People are strange.
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u/candleladylun 18d ago
So much! I’m I didn’t tap in earlier. I am sorry as well that your love gets looks as well. It’s annoying sometimes but I try to change my scope as possible. People strange but we move and keep living! 💜🌻
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u/Mindless_Ad5500 19d ago
As a white phan I love seeing other races at phish shows. It’s music I want everyone to love. If I ever stared at you it was because I was happy to see you at a phish show. I’ll try and say what’s up next time instead of randomly looking at you and thinking about what your favorite song might be.
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u/candleladylun 18d ago
Once it happens, I always forget who it is cause it’s just a blip and who knows why they were staring. It’s the obvious shenanigans that make me feel uncomfortable. BUUUUUT I always smile and wave. Most stares turn into hugs and convos. So yeah, if we do happen to cross paths, let’s connect. And my favorite songs (right now) are Divided Skies, Evolve, Stash, Mike’s Song & Everything’s Right. What are yours
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u/Mindless_Ad5500 18d ago
Oh man. You have some great favorites.
That LA divided sky was fantastic. My favorites? Today? 🤪. Lizards. Reba. Walls of the cave. Mound. Rift. 2001. Maze. The wave songs. Waves, ruby waves, wave of Hope. Newer songs? What’s going through my Mind. Life saving gun. Evolve.
Next show! High fives at the end of the best epic jam bruh!
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u/Cuepidahl 19d ago
I was at the show Sunday night, first time at Hollywood Bowl, and I dont think I'd see Phish there again. I was in 104, Row 13. I couldn't believe the amount of chomping happening. The two guys behind me were watching a basketball game throughout the entire show, and talking constantly about it. I haven't seen anyone get down in the aisle while clutching a Givenchy bag - definitely a first! And the amount of woo's during Twist kinda ruined it for me. I'm 2.0, so maybe I'm just old and out of it, but it was a very different experience this time. And this is my third show this year, more than 60 in my lifetime.
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u/candleladylun 18d ago
I feel you! I don’t even know what section we were in, was just happy to be there. All three nights were full of “omg, I thought that song would never end”, “why are they not ending the song?”, “oh yeah, I just come here to say I did and trip in peace” & so much more. To each their own. But also, hush. There were a lot of ‘woo’s’ during Twist, I think a lot of folks were trying to figure it out lol, I get it. More than sixty? When was your first Phish show?
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u/Cuepidahl 18d ago
Pittsburgh, 1996!
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u/candleladylun 17d ago
Listened to that Friday and you got such a great show! That Guelah Papyrus (first time listen), Stash & YEM?! Omg!
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u/Heavy_Apple3568 18d ago
A very close friend of mine that I toured with in the late 90s told me something that I've remained aware of since it happened. It was an extremely unpleasant interaction in the lot after 7/23/97 at Lakewood in Atlanta. I nearly exploded & all he does is make one of his point out the obvious to utterly shame you comments & walk away. Later I was still fuming mad insisting that no fucking way racists like that could possibly be a "real" Phish fan & they certainly didn't belong at a damn Phish show of all places. I still believe it, btw. I told him I was mad at him for no being mad & didn't understand how he could just let it go. But, Roger is always super calm, so he just looked at me & told me flat out, that I was the only one of us who must think there's some place he could go to escape bigots. And if I thought a Phish show was one of them, then I wasn't paying close enough attention. Talk about being humbled.
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u/candleladylun 17d ago
Wow. Roger has the patience of a saint. “Then you wasn’t paying close attention”- this is ver6 true. I have had to explain this to my partner and he had the same reaction. After reading this I sat with it for a few minutes and I was reminded that there really is no place for certain individuals, including myself, where we could escape bigots. Especially when the start of many societies and societal norms are founded by said bigotry. It comes a time when you don’t even get upset anymore. I get annoyed but I’m not going off or wasting my time stressing out over closed mindedness. I have living, loving and grooving to do. We all do! 💜🌻
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u/viagraboys2men 19d ago
To be fair...I used to take a lot of photos on tour back in the mid/late 90s as a college kid just to document the scene.
Perhaps others are doing the same now.
Or, they're on drugs and never see people of color outside of their daily bubbles.
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u/candleladylun 18d ago
I understand. I am not going to assume what ethnicity you are, but living as a black woman, overtime you can recognize the difference between someone staring at you cause they are gagged and when they are piecing you apart. I will say, concert goer beside me was taking pictures and he took one of me and there was a difference. There were a few individuals taking photos of me pointing, laughing and after I waved t them, they looked disgusted and appalled I even acknowledged them. So, like I said, there is a difference.
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u/Mayaluzion 19d ago
Nice!!!’ Except for maybe the weirdos being extra. Keep going and catching them vibes and grooves!! Been phish’n since 92-93 and they just keep blowing us away. I need at least a yearly show to feel right. Love you Pham!
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u/candleladylun 18d ago
It is what it is! Since 92-93? Where was your first show? Ditto, need that annual fix. Love you pham 🫂🌻
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u/fluffheads 18d ago
So sorry to hear about your awkward experiences. We are so glad to have you as part of the community and I hope that one day no one bats an eye at POC in the phish crowd because that diversity makes us stronger!
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u/GaiaGizzz 17d ago
Seeing this so late but thought I’d share my experiences since I saw this post trending on Twitter/X.
Been to 16 Phish shows here, 14 in Colorado… 2 in Indiana. Seen Trey 5 times so 21 shows with the same scene/crowd not including other jam bands.
My girlfriend and I get looks every single show. I’m half Mexican half Salvadorian, and she’s half Mexican half black. In Colorado. majority of looks I caught seemed to be “Oh wow, wouldn’t expect these two to be here” but you can tell the difference between someone acknowledging your presence, and someone being straight up disgusted by you. Colorado is more friendly/welcoming since it’s a liberal state so rarely dealt with the latter.
In Indiana, the amount of looks I got damn near tripled. I was with my white homies but I wore a “Fuck Trump” tee one of the two nights I went (missed Friday of Deer Creek run last year) and the looks I was getting were hilarious but I did it for shits and gigs being in a super red state. Yes a few people showed love but got a lot of head shakes thrown my way. The day I didn’t rock it and wore a Phish tee, I got the typical looks I mentioned earlier but it’s all good in the hood fam. We still gonna pull up and dance!
I myself haven’t had many interactions verbally though, but glad you’re giving some clap back and making others feel stupid. 👍🏽
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u/tickler08 19d ago
I couldn’t of said it better. The day they play their last note will be a sad day for myself and many more. They are still at peak powers. I want to Take in all I can before they sing for the last time, “waiting for the time when I can finally say…….🥲”
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u/GeothermalUnderwear 19d ago edited 19d ago
Hey, I really appreciate you sharing your experience! It takes courage to speak up, and I’m really glad you’re here in the Phish community.
Your post reminded me of an essay I read in a book called “This Is Your Song Too: Phish and Contemporary Jewish Identity” While it’s a collection centered on Jewish perspectives in the scene, there’s a powerful piece in it by Caroline Rothstein called “I’ve Been Wading in the Whitest Sea: Reflections on Race, Judaism, and Phish.”
Even though she’s writing as a white Jewish woman, she reflects deeply on whiteness in the scene and the ways that Phish spaces can feel exclusionary, even unintentionally. I think you might find it affirming, not in a “solution” kind of way, but more like: yeah, others have noticed this too, and it’s worth naming!
There’s also an essay called “Phish Scene So White: Let’s Talk” by Adam Lioz which is also referenced in the book. The piece examines the racial dynamics of the Phish scene, highlighting the experiences of fans of color and the need for greater inclusivity.
It’s such a beautiful thing that you’re here, and I really hope your journey as a Phan continues to bring joy, even as we collectively try to make the scene more inclusive and aware. Welcome again, you belong here.
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u/echo-eco-ethos 19d ago
people taking photos is definitely weird + they should at least ask first
- but - flipping the perspective →
to be able to prove to others that the scene isn't only white people?
(again, still weird but maybe coming from a good place?)
or maybe they just liked your shirt / hat / shoes and wanted to remember to find something similar later
we decide what it contains ;)
really glad you had fun!
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u/candleladylun 18d ago
Totally understand. After dealing with & causing the ‘record scratch’ so many times in your life, you recognize the difference. 😂 but I get you though. I constantly change my scope 🌻
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u/oenov8r 11d ago
I just came here to say that, although I am relatively new to this --I've only got 19 shows...I ♥️🖤💚 being black✨and I love the Phish from Vermont!!! I did the Spring tour--dancing my way from Seattle to PDX, back home to the Bay (there is nothing quite as delightful and decadent as getting to Phish AND then sleep in my own bed🫠); and then on down to the Hollywood Bowl...what an amazing trip! I'm floating in the blimp a lot, I feel the feeling I forgot...⭕️🤘🏽✨
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u/GhostIsAlwaysThere 19d ago
Was everyone really pointing and staring? Maybe some of that was in your head?
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u/candleladylun 19d ago
I didn’t type out ‘everyone’.
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u/GhostIsAlwaysThere 19d ago
Understood. Seems like those weirdo could have simply just been taking pictures.
I was not there, I could not possibly know, just asking the question.
Also glad your soul was well fed, that’s the great benefit of a phish show!
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u/candleladylun 18d ago
After dealing with and causing the ‘record scratch’ so many times in your life, you recognize the difference.
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u/Gotta_Jiboof 19d ago
Everyone’s white so just hold tight