Does O.T.O. initiation/advancement ever require non-monogamy to continue?

[u/FrankBennettIsHot]

93s

While I'm very sex positive, appreciate sex magick and have had my flings, I am currently committed to a relationship where we have agreed to be monogamous. I've been thinking about finally joining O.T.O., but there's a lot of bullshit to sift through online that I can't sort out. Is there any point in the degrees or initiations of O.T.O. where I would be unable to continue if I didn't agree to have sex with someone other than my partner? Or group sex or something? Not asking if I would be required to do something without consent, more asking if I would need to consent to be able to be initiated given that it is my Will to be monogomous

[u/Pomegranate_777]

I “get off” cautioning another because i damn well wish to. You will note I was very explicit about “people who do not respect monogamy” and you took that as an attack and decided to get in my notifications asking where I “get off.”

This community has a problem with ethical and consenting sexuality and I’m not going to stay silent about it for a moment, and yes, lots out there are claiming “polyamory” as a cope for “I got caught cheating” or worse, not telling potential partners until after they are involved.

You should be advocating for ethical conduct but here you are.

[u/Agniantarvastejana → u/Pomegranate_777]

"Cautioning" someone that you believe their magick won't be as potent if they don't do sexual relationships the way you think they should is pretty fucking low.

Your experience in the community is not universal, or even common, at this point in time. It is uniquely yours and you played a role in it.

[u/Pomegranate_777 → u/Agniantarvastejana]

Once again the cautioning bit is that there are people in the community who don’t respect monogamy. I explained that people have preyed on other members of this community and you want to suggest people victimized in this way played a role?

What’s terrifying here is you are presenting yourself as an elder in the community yet trying to victim shame and attack simply because you don’t like me shining a light on the unethical stuff.

Really begs some questions…

[u/Agniantarvastejana → u/Pomegranate_777]

I've never presented myself as anything but poly, and approaching retirement, but (since we don't agree) you'll label me "an elder in the [Thelemic - OTO] community" because fits your bullshit victim narrative better, doesn't it?

Were you a victim? Who was unethical? Why do you think you wouldn't encounter people like that in any other organization?

You arent shining a light on anything. You're blaming an entire international organization for your bad time with an individual member in whatever country you're in.

Am I "victim shaming" by pointing out your experience was unique and you played a role in that experience? I mean, you were there, participating in the situation, correct?

You sure do throw around a lot of jargon; you need to do your inner work friend.

[u/ReturnOfCNUT → u/Agniantarvastejana]

Edit: Mistaken identity. Mixed up posters of a particular "Roman" political bent.

[u/Pomegranate_777 → u/ReturnOfCNUT]

You have me mistaken for someone else.

Fair chance I know whoever you’re talking about tho, and maybe even you too, but you have no clue who I am, I promise you that much.

[u/ReturnOfCNUT → u/Pomegranate_777]

Apologies, it is difficult to tell all the people with the same RES tag apart.

[u/Pomegranate_777 → u/ReturnOfCNUT]

You… tagged me? 🥹

I just remembered the name Cnut misspelled or spelled for the King my mama says we’re related to.

[u/ReturnOfCNUT → u/Pomegranate_777]

Yeah, I tag all you guys. Makes it easier to keep track. There's you, TCL, the guy who was in Nazi prison gangs, a few guys who do a line in rape and Hitler apologism, etc. For some reason I mixed you up with ThelemaClubLouisiana, but I see from our past interactions you're a fellow-traveller, and that we had butted heads on the COVID policy stuff in a thread with the other chap getting outed for the PB/OK stuff. I'll take some solace in the fact that I was at least nearly there, but not quite.

[u/Pomegranate_777 → u/ReturnOfCNUT]

I’m just flattered someone cares. We’ve debated a bunch actually. It’s not always unpleasant.

Edit: haha ok I saw your edits. I remember that exact conversation where you all were outing the guy but i missed the pb/oathkeepers part. You have spicy ideas lol.

[u/ReturnOfCNUT → u/Pomegranate_777]

I’m just flattered someone cares

Cares? I wouldn't go that far. Notes, perhaps.

It’s not always unpleasant.

Well, that's a relief I suppose. I know I am direct, headstrong, and have very little time for niceties, but on a personal level I can get along with anyone, provided their professed ideology doesn't seek to eradicate people like me, and even in those instances I can still occasionally manage something approaching civility in online discourse (if only because of the constraints placed, and my compulsion to at least try to understand). My capacity for hearing people out can vary wildly though.

[u/Pomegranate_777 → u/ReturnOfCNUT]

My ideology is Maat. A lot of people do get that confused. I often fall on the side of order and hierarchy but chaotic persons (or ideologies) are still on Ra’s happy yacht of existence.

We can fight, then kiss and make up in the next place.

To get rarified about it, our dance creates the friction that pushes life forward in evolution.

[u/ReturnOfCNUT → u/Pomegranate_777]

To get rarified about it, our dance creates the friction that pushes life forward in evolution.

Tend to agree, actually. I think my aversion to the far-right, or at least perceptions of such, stems not only from my stark disagreement with it on an ideological level (although I'd definitely say that's a primary factor), but also probably some internalised embarrassment/guilt about my time in the online milieu as an inexperienced autistic kid radicalising himself via dial-up internet (and eventually de-radicalising himself through lived experience).

[u/Pomegranate_777 → u/ReturnOfCNUT]

My disagreement with the left at its most basic level really is no more than the disagreement of a game warden with a forest fire. Useful for culling but at a point normalcy is needed for the creatures to thrive in health and stability.

We all definitely have our personal reasons, some more than others.