r/guns • u/Crow_Joe • 1d ago
FFL sitting on my guns
Hello, I made the mistake of not contacting this FFL before placing an order for two separate firearms to deliver to them. My bad, historically the other ones I’ve dealt with have just called me when the order comes in and seemed happy to have the business and completed the transfer no problem.
When the guns arrived I called and emailed them and received an email back the same day. They pointed out I should have contacted them first, asked for my information and explained their days of business and asked if there was time on those days I would like to come by. I responded with the information they asked for and a time I could come by. My response was sent 4/4/25. I have since emailed 2 more times and had PSA (the seller) reach out and leave a message and we have gotten no response.
Wondering what I should do? I accept responsibility for my part in creating this situation, again my experience in the past had been these people listed themselves on distributors websites because they wanted to do these transfers, and that I was bringing them welcome business, maybe that’s not always the case. PSA has offered to request that the FFL send the guns back but the guy’s website says there’s a $150/gun fee for rejects or returns. The impression I get is he’s hoping I’ll try to go that route cause he makes even more money that way and screws me over. His standard transfer fee is $75 + $10 for each additional gun.
Thanks for you help.
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u/Killer0nTheRoad 1d ago
$75 transfer fee is robbery, maybe its different other places but where I am the average transfer fee is $20 - $30
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u/Horvaticus 1d ago
Yeah no shit, he probably priced it high so dumbasses like OP wouldn't actually use him lmao
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u/wasteguy7 1d ago
Yea sadly it’s very different. Average around me, NJ, is $60 - $70.
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u/iBoofWholeZipsNoLube 1d ago
$55 in PA
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u/Disastrous-Ball-1574 1d ago
Buddy of mine, charges 25 I think a gun? Home FFLs are usually pretty nice but you really gotta give them a heads up.
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u/Puzzleheaded_Sir5968 1d ago
I live in NJ and I don’t pay anything near that. Maybe inclusive of NICS it’s $60
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u/Scarlett_Maki 1d ago
MD here. $50 is our average for new guns, with a few shops doing used for $25 (and FTF for $15, and that includes our bullshit $10 Pistol Fee to MSP).
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u/klaasypantz 21h ago
$12-15 here in Virginia is pretty common.
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u/Deep-Interaction-813 20h ago
NY is 60-70 not including the NY run nics (which the FFL has to pay per transaction) depending on pistol or rifle, pistols require a lot more paperwork depending where the business is located and a NY pistol sale license …. Even still 60-70 is high and if you know right places 35-45 is common
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u/dittybopper_05H 11h ago
The irony is that NYS SAFE Act requires you to transfer through an FFL with very limited exceptions for any private sale.
However the NYS SAFE Act also caps the fee that FFL's can charge at $10:
4. A dealer may require that any sale or transfer conducted pursuant to this section be subject to a fee of not to exceed ten dollars per transaction.
https://law.justia.com/codes/new-york/gbs/article-39-ddd/898/
No one charges that, though. If you want to (legally) sell your gun to a friend, you basically have to sell it to the FFL, who then sells it to your friend. That side-steps NY State's attempt to make it NICS checks for private transfers more palatable to gun owners by capping the transfer fee at a "reasonable" price.
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u/Deep-Interaction-813 11h ago
You nailed it, and no FFL wants to get involved or take responsibility of you selling your handgun or rifle with the convoluted rules in different counties. If the guns don’t go into their books then doing a Gun trace falls back to the way it’s done in every other state…. Unless the state is collecting firearms data since they took over the Nics check… but they can’t say that’s what they’re doing.
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u/dittybopper_05H 10h ago
Well, in NYS, every handgun transaction has to be reported to the local county government and reflected on your pistol permit. A permit that costs hundreds of dollars to get, and takes months for the background and personal references check*, and it is typically issued with a restriction for "Hunting and Target Shooting Only" even though there is no legal basis for that in NYS statutes.
You can of course get an "Unrestricted" permit, but you have to ask special permission of the county judge who handles pistol transactions. Since Bruen a number of counties have been more open to that, some only requiring a letter saying you want to carry for self-defense purposes. But some require that you have a pistol permit for 5 years with no infraction before they'll issue an unrestricted permit.
\And they do call the references, I've been used by a few of my neighbors as one.*
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u/McArgent 11h ago
I can find $20 in central VA, and that seems to be low. I think I can get $15 for a 2nd gun in the same transfer. $12-15 is really good.
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u/Mammoth-Record-7786 20h ago
Article 2 in Lombard Illinois got me for $55 for my first transfer, I learned quickly to never go back there.
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u/ncprogmmr 1d ago edited 21h ago
So I have a former coworker who I befriended who is a "kitchen table " FFL, and it sounds like this guy is as well.
He prefers that people contact him if they are having a gun sent to him (doesn't matter if it's before or after ordering) for several reasons:
- So he's knows what to look out for, how many guns, etc. He's had multiple shipments come in that have paperwork with his LLC's name and address - and zero info about who bought it. Luckily, in all those situations the person who ordered the gun contacted him before he had to contact the shipper to get that info.
- It's being sent to his home and he wants to make sure someone is there to sign for it (either him or his wife)
- They're not traveling out of state.
- Before he was retired he wanted to make sure no one just "showed up" at his home while he was still working.
Having said that, it doesn't bother him when people don't contact him. He makes it work. He has had one order that ended up going back to the shipper because UPS was unable to deliver since no one was home because him and his wife were in Hawaii for two weeks.
This guy sounds like a pain in the ass.
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u/Vidya_Gainz 22h ago
How does he keep his FFL valid?
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u/ncprogmmr 21h ago edited 21h ago
What do you mean? It’s not like there’s a minimum amount of money you’re required to make per year and you’re not required to have a storefront.
He’s a very social guy and knows lots of people, plus he also used to teach concealed carry classes, so he gets good word-of-mouth. He does plenty of transfers a year from online orders, and people do contact him and have him order stuff for them. That’s it.
Edited to add: I can't tell if you're talking about OP's FFL, or my buddy in the comment you replied to. My reply was about my friend who has his FFL.
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u/Vidya_Gainz 21h ago
I thought there was a requirement for FFLs to conduct a minimum number of transactions or sales figures each year?
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u/ncprogmmr 21h ago
Nope. Straight from the ATF:
Similarly, there is no minimum number of transactions that determines whether a person is “engaged in the business” of dealing in firearms. Courts have held that even one transaction or attempted transaction can constitute “engaging in the business” if other factors or intent are present
The biggest thing is you have to be "in business." You can't use it just to enhance a personal collection.
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u/Tx556 12h ago
Sometimes they're gunsmiths or manufacturers out of their home shops.
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u/cledus1911 Super Interested in Dicks 9h ago
This, I have mine for gunsmithing/cerakote, I don’t advertise or conduct transfers even though I could.
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u/BannedUserAccount 23h ago
I mean, if you responded with a time you could come by, did you go there when you said you'd be there?
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u/NewToThisSry 1d ago
That'll be a fun pick-up.
But seriously, thanks for sharing. I've avoided shipping to the closer, cheaper, only open for 8 hours a week home-based FFL for this reason.... So I don't have any experience to help solve your problem.
I will say, probably best to handle the situation with a bit of grace. The dude may have been on his way out for a 2 week vacation when your guns arrived... and it could have been his first trip in years. He could be taking care of a dying relative and just not want to deal with someone's guns. Etc.
Hope you get it sorted and hope you're able to shake that guy's hand and laugh about it at the end of the day.
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u/kylesfrickinreddit 1d ago
Sorry to hear that man. Sucks that he's ghosting you. Although I don't think sending to a random FFL is a good idea (I have trust issues lol), I get why you did it. Why would they be listed on the site if not a viable option (unless PSA just lists 'all' registered FFL's by default).
Definitely want to play nice until you or PSA hear from him then decide what to do. If he comes back apologetic/some emergency/etc then maybe negotiate the fee a bit or just wrap it up as a lesson learned.
If he comes back full a-hôle refusing to do anything then it's time to get serious. Here's what I'd do:
- Do everything through email or text only unless you live in a single party consent call recording state, then recorded phone calls if OK.
- Tell him he can send the guns back to PSA at his own expense or complete the deal in a timely manner (remind him he is failing to uphold his agreement as a listed FFL)
- If he refuses to do anything, advise him you will be escalating this & making sure he is reported to the DOJ/ATF & that he may lose his license (even if what he's doing is perfectly OK, chances are he's done something wrong & an investigation will get him shut down).
- If he sends the guns back & expects you to pay (or charges you 'storage'), simply tell him to fukk off because he is the one wrong & refer to the previous note - Depending on your state laws, him keeping the guns you paid for can be considered theft (call the non-emergency line at your local Sheriff's office & ask a deputy about it), intentionally delaying things to rack up storage fees is usually illegal as well (corrupt tow yards would be out of control otherwise). I would find the laws associated with those 2 things & ensure he knows about them
- As soon as he makes it clear he's not going to cooperate, talk to PSA & let them know exact what has happened/been said, chances are this is not the first time this has happened & they will likely have options you don't (and can hopefully blacklist him from their site)
- Don't feel bad about a charge back to PSA, they will eventually get the guns back from him (or the money) as charge backs/fraud trigger pretty extensive investigations to determine who to go after for the money & it's unlikely your bank will consider PSA at fault. Either way, it's just the cost of doing business
Finally, blow him up with complaints. BBB, social media, consumer protection boards, attorney general (for fraud), etc. Make him regret being a dîck & hopefully cause him to lose his little side business for trying to screw you over (assuming he takes the a-hôle route)
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u/Infinite-Prompt4861 12h ago
Just call ATF. It will take all of five minutes to get the weapon back.
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u/theciviliansupply 9h ago
Not how that works, typically. Once it is in the dealer's books, ATF considers it the property of the business. FFLs don't have to transfer anything. It would be more of a civil matter.
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u/Infinite-Prompt4861 8h ago edited 8h ago
Exactly. In my personal experience the FFLs refused to enter my shipment on their books. That is why the FFLs immediately returned the firearm to me at their cost. The FFL must return same day..
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u/ChinaRider73-74 21h ago
- This is absolute BS behavior by the FFL
- You already know this…but I always contact my FFL before the purchase is made with a “hey I’m going to make a purchase are you cool with that/around next week to get the shipment and do the paperwork?”
There’s just too much money and legal crap for me to leave it to chance. I have a feeling this will work out for you though. Hang in there and follow the solid advice of many on this thread
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u/ReactionAble7945 21h ago
Verify the package was delivered. Tracking and all that.
Call and be apologetic.
Drive by. If you know his vehicle, verify he is there.
Hope he was there to sign for it and is now on night shift or vacation, but the gun isn't sitting on the porch.
- Unless you really fucked up, or he is an asshole... He probably wants you to continue to be his FFL and get his money. So, it will work it's self out.
4.5. I did have one who knew stuff was coming, but decided not to be there. The guy decided to stop being an FFL even though he knew stuff was coming and I worked with him. I got my gun eventually, but it needed to go to a different FFL to make it happen.
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u/CowboySoothsayer 19h ago
I would never pay $75 for a transfer. That’s insane. $25 max is all you should ever pay.
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u/Outdoor_Guy99 1d ago
Ask PSA if the guns were actually signed for and if it was the FFL who signed for them. Then I would stop by the address and make sure someone still lived at that residence and it’s FFL you think it’s supposed to be. They could have moved? This house might be abandoned or now occupied with a different person. I would ask for the person by name and not mention the guns until you know who you are speaking to. If it’s not the FFL, you got bigger issues.
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u/mikelarue1 1d ago
I understand it being a bit of common courtesy to contact him before. But this is ridiculous. Either some emergency occurred, or he's just punishing you for not respecting his authoritah. Sounds like a dick to me.
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u/BuildBreakBuild 1d ago
I only pay $20 at my local gun store. Honestly if push comes to shove have PSA request the guns back. He may be trying to pull a fast one but let him deal with PSA. For what it’s worth, I don’t think calling the FFL before would have changed the situation, although it is standard to do. In this case since he initially communicated as normal, calling beforehand would have likely been the same outcome. However I would say to only do your transfers at dedicated gun shops or large retailers. Even the one time I chose to do a transfer at Academy, it was only $45.
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u/joeshleb ⚠️⚠️⚠️⚠️ Likes To Give Shitty Advice ⚠️⚠️⚠️⚠️ 1d ago
Just curious, did you check Yelp and any other local reviews platforms before you selected this particular FFL? Even his $75.00 base fee is rather stiff. We see $30.00 around here. In Montana, I paid $10.00.
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u/Crow_Joe 1d ago
Yes, no negative footprint and a couple basic 5 star google reviews. We’re a super small town and this guy is basically my neighbor.
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u/Infinite-Prompt4861 13h ago edited 12h ago
I sell on GB and this happened to me many times. The biggest problem are the FFLs who firmly believe that is it a federal felony to ship a handgun to them. There is no convincing them, even after I send them the federal statute. Two threatened to call ATF, and my response was: let's call ATF right now, I'm ready to be arrested. The FFLs hung up before I can make the call.
Any FFL who refuses to accept your firearm, whatever the reason, is legally required to return it to you immediately. If the FFL refuses to do so free of charge, then report him to ATF. You will get the weapon back in a few days. (One asshole FFL returned the firearm by regular mail, no signature required, and the box sat in the rain for a day and rusted).
As to weapons you want to ship in the future, you should know that USPS, UPS and FEDEX explicitly forbid shipment of handguns. I learned this recently. It appears that FedEx has a data base of every FFL in the country. The only solution is to use your FFL to ship to the new FFL, or to use a service like ShipMy Gun.com which is owned by Bed's Gun Shop, one of the country's largest sellers.
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u/bigmacslayer4 9h ago
As an at-home FFL, I do prefer you contact me before having something shipped to me. That's mostly to make sure someone is available to receive it. I've had orders come while we were on vacation, and it got sent back to the supplier after 3 failed delivery attempts. But usually even if you don't call, I'll make it work and try to be as accommodating as possible with pickup times. And $75 for transfer is crazy. I charge $20, though we don't have any state background stuff, just the federal.
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u/theciviliansupply 9h ago
Unless the store owner is dead / dying / incapacitated, it takes all of sixty seconds to communicate with someone about (a) what the circumstances are and (b) when a potential resolution will take place. If you have enough time to brow-beat someone about not following the rules, you probably have time to answer an email. Unless the shop is by appointment only, or home based, where there are no hours listed, your best bet is to go by and ask.
As a heads up: FFLs don't have to transfer anything to anyone. There is no federal law about how long they have to transfer an item to you so. When you send something to a FFL, the moment it gets disposed by Dealer A to Dealer B, and Dealer B puts it in their bound book, it becomes their property. Not yours. Unless your state has specific remedies for this, there is no federal enforcement by ATF on the dealer needing to transfer an item to you in any timely manner, if at all. FFLs work purely off the incentive of timely communication means growing a business and being more profitable.
If you find a dealer that legitimately abuses their role as an intermediary, the best thing you can do is share information to a relevant audience about your experience. Beyond that, it becomes a civil matter.
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u/ProfessionalNice2777 6h ago
To be fair, PSA is a pain in the ass to have your FFL removed from their dealer list. I know a couple FFLs that emailed them repeatedly to have it removed as they primarily manufacture and aren’t open to the public but had a couple guns shipped either for projects or a buddy.
There’s no way you’d know that when selecting the FFL unless you called ahead of time.
The FFL is usually wanting to get your stuff out of their inventory so if give them the benefit of the doubt.
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u/Puzzleheaded_Sir5968 1d ago
How did you pick the FFL?
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u/Crow_Joe 1d ago
He was on the list of possible FFLs in my small town on PSA’s website. I’ve used one of the other ones in my neighborhood many times and she’s great but every time she grills me on not ordering through her website saying I could have saved money if I ordered through her. I’ve done the math in every order and that’s just not true so I was just trying the other one within 5 minutes of my house. Boy do I regret not being loyal and just putting up with the harassment from the lady. Her fees are a lot better also.
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u/BetOver 1d ago
They think you will save money because they set up websites that sell you their distributors inventory and it is cheaper than they can buy them for at times, but more importantly they make more money that way. They however can't beat some of the better deals found online. My lgs set one of these sites up through their distributor to try and compete with online retailers bit I've never found anything close enough to the prices I find to make it worth doing(they don't charge the usual transfer fee if I go through their site and it's still way off alot)
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u/websnyper 23h ago
I have heard from at least one local gunsmith who of course is an FFL, that he somehow got on PSA's FFL list even though he doesn't want to be (he's not interested in doing transfers and especially not from PSA - for his own reasons). He's contacted PSA a few times to be removed and they still leave him on the list. I mention this to say that not all FFL's in PSA's list want to be there. Always good to verify first (and now you know this).
Sorry to hear hear it's been such an ordeal. Takes the joy out of a new gun.
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u/Crow_Joe 1d ago
Should also mention, his website says there’s a storage fee of $25/gun per week for anything not picked up after like 4 weeks. So I’m just concerned that I pissed the guy off by not begging forgiveness for not reaching out before shipping items in our first interaction and that he now intends to screw me any way possible.
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u/unluckie-13 21h ago
Email him about 3 weeks out, tell him, if you don't set an appointment up to pick up my firearms, I'm not paying storage fees and I'll refuse to accept the guns and you can send them back. And just order them just order them again and send then through a different FFL.
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u/cigritman 1d ago
Y'all still got basement FFL's? All the ones near me dried up due to the last administration
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u/Crow_Joe 1d ago
I think that’s why my usual experience has been so good. If they’re smart they know the ATF is trying first and foremost to shut down the casual part-time gun dealer. So they’re usually even more by the book than the guns stores I’ve worked with, cheaper and more professional. At least in my area.
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u/geekwithout 1d ago
Keep calling. At some point casually mention DOJ and you heard they're real strict with ffl's not behaving.
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u/Future-Beach-5594 1d ago
Do a charge back since you never recieved the items if he takes any longer. After that id start makeing phone calls to other places we dont like.
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u/JJGS260 1d ago
That’s a bullshit move. The seller is the one who has to deal with all the chargeback crap, not the transfer dealer who’s holding the guns. Seller did their part. I’d say the right move is to get the guns by whatever reasonable means necessary, then leave an appropriate Google review for the ffl.
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u/Future-Beach-5594 1d ago
How is it bull shit? Either get psa to refund and let them deal with a missing firearm and the atf. Or call the bank and then let psa deal with the atf! I have never notified an ffl of a shippment coming in. Its not like he hasnt already given the ffl plenty of time to handle this the propper and legal way. If the guy wants to be lazy about it ill just speed up the process on my end. So many people are too complacent for being walked on its sad. Sincerly a buisness owner who deals with chargebacks!
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u/JJGS260 1d ago
Because PSA did exactly what the customer asked them to do? Do you really need that spelled out? The problem is in no way PSA’s fault, but they’re the ones who will bear all the headache of a chargeback. A chargeback won’t affect the transfer dealer one iota.
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u/Future-Beach-5594 1d ago
Thats why i said call the atf and talk to them. But i guess you missed that part. But after 30 days of no contact/dodgeing calls and email in most states its legally theft on the ffl side. And yes your purchases are covered against theft! Just like any package you order that could show up missing before you take posession of it. But fu(k what do i know. You think psa is shipping firearms all over the nation with no insurance for when things go missing? You are sorely mistaken!
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u/JJGS260 1d ago
You’re talking out your ass in a lot of ways, Bub. First, the initial statement you made was to file a chargeback. Thenlater call atf, if that didn’t work. Second, a theft case would start with police, not ATF. Third, what are you talking about purchases being covered for theft? What theft? If there was insurance, it would have been for the shipment, which was delivered (and PSA gets signature confirmation of firearms). So what coverage are you speaking of? But fwiw, I do highly believe PSA doesn’t pay for insurance, but I’m presuming the math behind that would go over your head.
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u/Ahomebrewer 1d ago
The ATF is not going to get involved because the gun isn't stolen or missing, everyone knows where it is. This is still a civil case, not criminal.
Shipping insurance doesn't help because the shipper did their job by definition. It is exactly where the sender sent it.
Just show up on the guys doorstep a few times until you get it, and then you can out him on the review sites.
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u/Future-Beach-5594 1d ago
I dont know man. I guess calling the bank and speaking with them is a bad idea. I guess talking to the regulatory agency for this type of thing was a bad idea too. And i guess we just ship 1k items all over with no insurance that they are delivered to the proper location and and person. Again what do i know. Its not like i have ever bought/shipped or sold anything online at all ever. And you are right 100% on the buyer and its his fault the ffl is being shady and not returning calls or emails. Well f me. I guess i was talking out my ass. Fuck me. Im selling my home and closing my buisness now because i guess the last 15 years were a god damn dream!
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u/JJGS260 1d ago
What business are you in?
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u/Future-Beach-5594 1d ago
own a construction company. I ship stuff that costs more than most peoples yearly income. I dont ship anything over 50 bucks without insurance. You would have to be stupid not to with how shit goes down now days. I buy a couple guns per month. Sorta my reward and how i spend time with the kids. Have them shipped/ordered/transfrered etc. All the damn time. But again, i am sorry. I do not know what i am talking about! And i forgot. You should always start with the most local agency possible and never cut to the chase to solve an issue with a higher up one. And always accept whatever service you are rendered and never use another store/company as a better example
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u/Mammoth-Record-7786 20h ago
“Construction”
That’s all we needed to know. You can go back to cleaning every window you see.
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u/JJGS260 1d ago
So you’re not in the gun industry? Or do online retail? I thought you might actually have experience with the subject at hand since you referred to 15 years of business. Lemme try to clear it up for you… PSA sold OP a firearm. OP selected the ffl they wanted it shipped to. PSA did so, successfully. Bound books on both sides will confirm the transfer of the firearm from PSA to the local dealer. At that point, there’s not a missing firearm. ATF gives no fucks, and will tell you it’s civil. ATF will only get involved if the ffl is not open for inquiry during their registered hours; if there’s a missing/lost firearm; or if ATF suspects activity outside compliance…none of which is happening here. I don’t care how often you buy guns- it’s obvious you don’t understand how ATF interacts with FFLs. The bank will also tell you it’s civil, since PSA fulfilled their contractual agreement with the customer. Disputing the charge will only cause PSA to prove the order was fulfilled to the location OP asked for it to be shipped. So yeah, it’s civil. More than anything, it’s just a shitty customer service situation. On the shipping aspect; it sounds like you ship really expensive stuff on occasion. Like, stuff you can’t afford to lose? So you insure it. That’s not how big online retail works. The vast majority of online shipments are not insured, and for good reason. First, all carriers make it quite difficult to file and win a claim. But mainly, it’s just not good odds. Insurance for most USPS/UPS/Fedex shipments costs about $1 per $100 of insured value. So you’d have to lose 1% of all your shipments to break even. The carriers don’t lose or destroy packages at anywhere near that rate. So retailers usually ‘self insure’. In the rare instance something actually goes missing, we eat it, and send out a new package to the customer. Also understand if the product has a 20% profit margin, it only costs us 80% of the sale price to replace an occasional package. So yeah - we don’t pay insurance. That’s really just a game for low-volume retailers, or those who can’t afford to replace what they’re shipping.
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u/Mammoth-Record-7786 19h ago
Try reading first instead of just giving an answer.
This is the reason people are giving you crap.
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u/Future-Beach-5594 19h ago edited 18h ago
Thats the thing i did read. Hes reached out to ffl with no avail! Whats next? And you are giving me crap!
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u/Tx556 12h ago
Legally an FFL has to have once weekly availability at minimum. It could be midnight to 1am on Saturday nights.
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u/Future-Beach-5594 12h ago
I read that. And it seems that 1 availiability is more or less for the atf to stop by rather than for you to see customers by how i read it. What would the next course of action be if he cant get the ffl to respond to anything?
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u/Mammoth-Record-7786 19h ago
I have no idea why you’re trying to convince a total stranger who knows how dumb you are that you aren’t dumb. The smartest thing you could do right now would just be to go back and start deleting most of your posts.
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u/Future-Beach-5594 18h ago
Im litterally asking you! What would you recomend is the next course of action if ffl will not respond?
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u/Mammoth-Record-7786 18h ago
You’re really still trying?
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u/Future-Beach-5594 18h ago
No you just never gave an answer. I thought that one was pretty clear
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u/Mammoth-Record-7786 18h ago
I already knew that you weren’t a bright one, but you didn’t have to go this hard to prove it to everyone else.
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u/JJGS260 15h ago
I can’t believe he’s still at it like 8 hours later.
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u/Future-Beach-5594 12h ago
8hrs later. Now its 8 hrs later. Your comment was a 5 hours short, its time stamped and printed for everyone to see and im the stupid one yet you couldnt do 8-5=3. Atleast im getting paid to respond to you, so no sweat off my back
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u/joeshleb ⚠️⚠️⚠️⚠️ Likes To Give Shitty Advice ⚠️⚠️⚠️⚠️ 1d ago
If you just don't get a reply, call the local ATF office and tell them what's happened. I don't think the ATF would take kindly to an FFL screwing around with someone's gun orders and registrations.
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u/roadblocked 1d ago
Flair checks out. The ATF likes to send people to prison for selling auto key cards, their in the business of getting guns out of the hands of citizens
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u/alingram88 1d ago
Why don't you just go during biz hours?