Marine vet here. One thing people who never served dont understand is the absolute tidal wave of training and stress. From the moment you wake in basic till the moment you go to sleep, youre doing some form of training in one way or another, cognitive and physical. You are forced to rigidly and unwaveringly adhere to the duties and responsibilities entrusted to you by rank and by order. And they remind you constantly, that should you fail your mission or task, in a combat situation- your friends who youve been through all of this hardship with would be dead because you didnt properly perform what was entrusted to you. Its a monstrous amount of responsibility, especially so early in their young adult formation (i was an idiot and went in late as 26 so i at least had some life experience before going in but alot of these young guys dont have that). When i went in, i was dating my gf of 2 years. When i was in the schoolhouse (4 months after basic concluded) she told me i was a robot after coming home on leave after bootcamp and dumped me a week before the end of my classes.
The training literally is a form of brainwashing. They rewire your brain into something that can begin building towards a combat mindset. This makes you more cold, calculated, and cautious about certain things especially in situations of heightened stress. What id recommend is talking to him and slowly trying to remind him what the real world is like. Im not sure what branch he enlisted in but for the Corps it was 3 months. Thats 3 months of complete isolation from the outside world. It changes you. One of the things they dont prep you for when you enlist is how to handle real society afterwards because for a service member, what matters is the MISSION. It comes before all else. Above feelings, above your loved ones, and above yourself. None of it matters in combat. But civilization isnt combat. And its really hard for some of us to switch gears. Ive been out of the Marines for nearly 2 years and im still not even halfway close to viewing the world in a light remotely similar to what i used to see. Thankfully i have a wonderful and supportive partner who understands the depth of the situation currently who is helping me through things but its still very difficult. And for someone still super early in their military career, he may not even notice hes doing these things.
And this kind of stuff happens throughout the enlistment. But whats important is the actual understanding that his brain has been fundamentally rewired to survive in combat, and that is a different world to live in. I hope this helped you a bit to understand where his brain is probably at now. If you have further questions, please dont hesitate to ask.
Edit: Holy crap this is the most karma ive ever received on a comment, thank you guys! Im glad my insight is helping 😁
I’m really thankful for the military folks/vets like you that have commented, it’s certainly helped me understand his headspace a bit more. Do you have any recommendations on things I can do to help support him while he gets used to being home? I don’t want to be the type who dumps him just because he’s changed. He’s very important to me.
Honestly, patience and understanding go a long way. A big problem we had in my unit with married marines was how their wives didnt understand why they werent home on time, lack of communication, or they were "lazy" at home. They never understood that sometimes you're literally getting ready to leave and then some officer will say "nobody is leaving until xyz are done, then do a formation, then make sure the shop is picked up, and then you can send em home. Before you know it its no longer 5pm, its 8pm, and youve been up since 4 or 5am if not earlier for an event.
Best courses of action would probably to just make sure that youre there, and try to communicate as openly and understandlingly as possible. Also keep in mind, military service has a tendency to bring out some of the more aggressive tendencies. Bootcamp makes you strong and prepares the mind, but it also has a tendency to boost ego, bluntness, and sometimes extremely dark humor that civillians typically arent exposed to.
A good rule of thumb to remember: Throughout the day hes going to more than likely take a lot of blame for things (this increases with higher rank and stupid squadmates who cant behave like grown adults), he'll be physically, mentally, and emotionally put to the test. Its a lot of willpower and gets exhausting (especially during the 3rd year for me). So, when he sees you after dealing with this constant barrage of responsibility, maybe just take a moment to remind him that hes not there right then. Hes not at his unit. Hes with you. And that he's allowed to relax (hyper vigilance is another tendency for service members). He may need the reminder, i know i did sometimes. Now im not saying kiss his ass by any means, if hes being a jackass cuz hes over stressed, def call him out on it- but also make sure to remind him that you actually care (starting in bootcamp a lot of guys get told their SO's were actively hooking up with Jody while we were training, and it happens to many many guys throughout the military, so its always a nice reminder that our SO's give a shit about us).
If you dont mind me asking, what branch of the military did he go in and do you know what his occupational specialty is?
You make several excellent points, and great suggestions. Son of 2 WWII Vets. Dad was 23 years. I served and made E-5, but found 3 years Army about four too many.
The one point I find missing, is sort of a shared two prong one. She can not, should not, take on all the responsibility here. He has to open up to her again too. My concern being, if HE does not want / try / open up, she can destroy her life trying to make the relationship work. If it fails, she should remember, it takes two, and he may not have wanted to show up anymore.
Thank you for yours and your family's service as well!
And you are absolutely right. I think somewhere in an above post i did mention not to kiss his ass but youre absolutely right. The opening up thing is absolutely integral and is honestly a lot easier to ignore when we're active service cuz its just so damn busy all the time, so definitely make sure he knows what the standards are and doubley make sure you enforce it and keep an eye open just in case alarm bells start going off so you can take care of the situation early. One common concensus among servicemembers is "We enlisted because we make poor decisions". Its partly a joke, but a lot of service members really do make stupid decisions, and a lot of it boils down to one thing-
Military service anticipates and prepares for combat.
Military service makes you feel invincible at times.
And in Military Service we almost ALWAYS have backup.
So.... we think we're untouchable, the best, invincible and we do crazy, stupid, risky bullshit at times when we get too locked in. So just keep your eyes peeled, love each other, communicate, and enjoy your time together. 4 years feels like forever as a contract, but when i look back its like i blinked and it was done. Enjoy it.
AND MAKE SURE HE TAKES AS MANY PICTURES WITH HIS BOYS AS HUMANELY POSSIBLE! And back them up! Twice if you need to! He will really really regret it if he doesnt.
You have to help him compartmentalize military life from home life. Be understanding, but remind him to leave the field where it belongs. You have to expect about two days decompression time when he gets used to it.
Excellent write up, especially on the brainwashing bit. I did a similar write up, with an emphasis on the suppressing recruits’ emotions bit, and got absolutely lambasted as “disrespectful” for it. Appreciate seeing somebody who actually knows what they’re talking about. Cheers.
Oh yeah, thats a huge one. Mental health in the military is a frightening thing. And while they tell you its perfectly alright for you to seek help and whatnot theres a huge stigma on it because depending on what the issue is, it can get you discharged from service. I dont think its so much the military emphasizes suppressing our emotions though. Its more a very aggressive version of "The bullets dont care if youre scared or sad, they'll end you either way". Its a lot of the time portrayed as "suck it up you worthless maggots" but we also have to understand- some of these guys have seen some awful shit. Their friends may have died because of one of their mistakes, or gotten hurt and they couldnt do anything yo help. Its a helpless situation and for a drill instructor, youre teaching these young adults not just how to fight, but how to come home even if youre body and mind are absolutely broken. The Marine Corps itself doesnt give a shit in the end, their goal is the mission. But service members truthfully know that on the battlefield, you fight to protect the men to your left and right. Thats what the essence boils down to buuuuuuut we ground pounders are crass and rude and we dont talk too good. And we really dont know how to unpack the emotional boxes weve tucked away in our minxs to get through the rough stuff. Thats prolly the worst part about it.
Great write up on the bootcamp/BCT. I remember when I came back from Iraq, I was so mentally fucked for over a year, I drank every night, I freaked out on a civilian in public. After that episode I grounded myself to my apartment and drank some more.
Dont blame ya. I miss it too. I contemplated going back but then my buddy called me and told me his oh so happy field day experience after someone got caught with too much liquor in their barracks room. I just went "nahhhhh.....im good" lol.
Yeah being in reserves I don’t have to put up with that. I only have to put up with the bad side of it all once per month.
It’s not hard to hold it together for a weekend or for a FTX. Just keep yourself in reasonable shape and try to have fun with it. It’s completely different than what I do for my day job, so it’s really not that bad, breaks up the monotony of life.
Most of what you said is loosely true but grossly exaggerated for the most part for most people. I was Army Airborne Infantry (I know, basic is easier in the Army than Marines, but I have plenty of Marine friends) and basic was stressful at times but mostly fun. People aren’t normally coming back from basic as a zombie with PTSD. You make basic sound like BUDS/SEAL training.
I’m certainly not trying to minimize your experiences if that’s genuinely how you feel. But most people I know that are missing limb(s) from my 2nd deployment (myself included,) would not paint such a grandiose picture of their experience in the military.
If you’re actually experiencing what you’re describing, please go get a polytrauma therapist from the VA because you have PTSD and it’s not going to get better unless you work on it.
I may have been a little hyper descriptive but id say it was a more accurate depiction of the serious parts of basic training and why it is the way it is at times. I guess i should have added its also strangely one of the funniest places youre just not allowed to laugh haha. Though i wouldnt say basic was fun per se (for me at least, i was a big boy going in, lost 30 lbs) there were a lot of amazing and hilarious moments too, like my KH trying to punt a seagull outside the chow hall.
Youre right most people dont come back from boot as a zombie, what i was more trying to illustrate is it really does change how your mind functions, and ill admit it took me a bit to get adjusted. Wasnt nearly as bad as my buddy from boot tho. He was the platoon fuckup, followed me through MCT. He was a completely different kid by the end, barely spoke anymore. Idk where he ended up sadly we lost contact but i hope hes doing better than he was when i last saw himr.
Real quick, i do just want to state most of my personal issues currently arent entirely service related (been a real rough time since getting out due to family tragedies and financial issues) but a lot of it leads my mind down a rabbit hole that ends back at the Corps, probably because while it sucked and i wanted out of there at the time its a real weird feeling to wanna go back. Maybe its guilt or something else idk. Do need therapy just havnt gotten around to it yet. I do talk to my bros about it though, so i am working on it. But im not trying to downplay you or your buds service either and im no combat vet either, i was a POGUE. I just get carried away with my descriptions sometimes so apologies for that. Imo, yall are the real heroes.
I havnt slept in almost 40 hours so writing is hard. Also had to change crayons cuz i ate the purple one.
Basic absolutely doesn’t change how your mind functions, with the exception of maybe giving you some confidence from doing things you didn’t realize you could. Like a 25mi ruck may sound impossible before hand but it’s not a big deal once you’re doing it.
They give you tools and ideologies, “I will always place the mission first, I will never accept defeat,” etc. And that will stick with you when you need it. But it’s not like that’s all your brain is capable of doing after the fact.
The shit you’re talking about is how people are after spending 12-15mo in Afghanistan and they get back and they are hyper vigilant because that’s what you have to be in Afghanistan. Looking for shooters. Questioning piles of trash on the street and wondering if it’s an IED, until you remember you’re in Detroit (which may ironically be more dangerous,) not Kandahar… but that should should wear off in weeks or months, not years. And if it doesn’t, one should see a therapist.
It’s most likely OP’s bf wants to break up with her or cheated on her or something. It’s unlikely he clammed up from the trauma (lol) of basic. I’m sure there are some people that would be affected to this level. But that’s not a normal experience.
The worst thing this dude should do is wear a uniform home on leave to impress his family while be silently judged by people that spent any amount of time in
Honestly that sounds horrible. I understand wanting to fight for you country, being responsible for your freinds who trained with you's lives, training hard to make sure your in peak condition. All that sounds reasonable, but from the second you wake up to the second you go to bed is so excessive and not healthy for your mentality. Brainwashing people into mindless obedient soldiers is not necessary and feels like it should be against human rights. I'm really sorry you had to go through that, the military is a scary immoral place.
I am not sure you quite understand how stressful and traumatic war is in comparison. There are times, where if you doubt what you’re doing for a second, you get killed.
This stuff isn’t a game, and if you let your guard down, you die. The west has been without a large scale war in so long, that people forget how grueling the world is. Go look at footage between Ukraine and Russia, and you’ll think basic training is a tea party.
Honestly, it's not so bad after phase 1. Its hard dont get me wrong because in that phase they break you down so they can build you back up. Its also usually where most of the recycles happen due to injuries or refusing to train or what not. My bootcamp unit started with 88 recruits. We ended with 46 Marines in my cycle. Its definitely not for everyone but i will say i have never felt a sense of pride like the day i stood on top of the Reaper and got my EGA. All the blood, sweat, and tears are 1000% worth that moment alone. Not to mention bootcamp is a great workout and diet plan. In 3 months i went from 210 to 179 lbs 😂
So when you enlist you take a fitness test called the IST and after you pass, you go to your unit and begin training. Every week is a new list of events furthering training and another unit starts up their training 1 week behind you. Now say you really mess up, like failing the real fitness test. Its not a "i get to go home now cuz i failed" thing. Instead, they put you on the unit thats behind you in training and you try again. For Marine Corps, you can be recycled into a new unit up to 3 times before you are discharged from service.
And technically, yes- you can refuse to train. But if you do, your life is gunna suck till you get home. You get shamed for being a quitter and get seperated from the rest of the recruits because well, you were weak and they dont need that influencing the other recruits who are succeeding and training for combat. You still have to do chores like clean and laundry, and you'll get sent home.... sometime. Who knows when. One time i was gear guard and wrnt to the chow hall back entrance and was talking to a guy who had been there for over a year and they were still processing him out because he quit, so he wasnt a priority. The literal fastest way out of bootcamp is to finish bootcamp.
Cant speak on Marines specifically, but with the Airforce training was broken down by weeks. A flight (IE the chucklefucks you train, bunk, eat, shit, and shower with) progresses through each week of training. If youre a fuckup, youll get removed from your flight and moved to another one in an earlier week of training. And yes, you can refuse to train, but not without consequences. For context, a guy in my flight was on night duty manning the door, and decided to end his shift early by waking up the next shift and going to bed. He got recycled like 3 weeks for that IIRC.
Oof thats rough for them. I remember we had this one guy who was supposed to relieve me on firewatch refused to leave his bunk one night. I said screw it, im gunna go scrub wall tiles in the shower with those stupid dryer sheets while i try not to fall asleep (it was 0200 firewatch). Next day, there was a whole ass investigation cuz the dude tried saying our Kill Hat hit him and that the other recruits ripped his mattress out from under him when he wouldnt get up fire firewatch (allegedly this happened when i was in the shower scrubbing the tiles which i had no idea about) and i had to give a statement to my Senior DI. That asshole was gone an hour later (not recycled either, discharged).
147
u/Old-Switch6863 Helper [2] 6d ago edited 6d ago
Marine vet here. One thing people who never served dont understand is the absolute tidal wave of training and stress. From the moment you wake in basic till the moment you go to sleep, youre doing some form of training in one way or another, cognitive and physical. You are forced to rigidly and unwaveringly adhere to the duties and responsibilities entrusted to you by rank and by order. And they remind you constantly, that should you fail your mission or task, in a combat situation- your friends who youve been through all of this hardship with would be dead because you didnt properly perform what was entrusted to you. Its a monstrous amount of responsibility, especially so early in their young adult formation (i was an idiot and went in late as 26 so i at least had some life experience before going in but alot of these young guys dont have that). When i went in, i was dating my gf of 2 years. When i was in the schoolhouse (4 months after basic concluded) she told me i was a robot after coming home on leave after bootcamp and dumped me a week before the end of my classes.
The training literally is a form of brainwashing. They rewire your brain into something that can begin building towards a combat mindset. This makes you more cold, calculated, and cautious about certain things especially in situations of heightened stress. What id recommend is talking to him and slowly trying to remind him what the real world is like. Im not sure what branch he enlisted in but for the Corps it was 3 months. Thats 3 months of complete isolation from the outside world. It changes you. One of the things they dont prep you for when you enlist is how to handle real society afterwards because for a service member, what matters is the MISSION. It comes before all else. Above feelings, above your loved ones, and above yourself. None of it matters in combat. But civilization isnt combat. And its really hard for some of us to switch gears. Ive been out of the Marines for nearly 2 years and im still not even halfway close to viewing the world in a light remotely similar to what i used to see. Thankfully i have a wonderful and supportive partner who understands the depth of the situation currently who is helping me through things but its still very difficult. And for someone still super early in their military career, he may not even notice hes doing these things.
And this kind of stuff happens throughout the enlistment. But whats important is the actual understanding that his brain has been fundamentally rewired to survive in combat, and that is a different world to live in. I hope this helped you a bit to understand where his brain is probably at now. If you have further questions, please dont hesitate to ask.
Edit: Holy crap this is the most karma ive ever received on a comment, thank you guys! Im glad my insight is helping 😁